As part of cost-saving measures outlined in the recent ‘Defence Equipment Plan 2021-2031’, plans for a new ground-based ballistic missile defence radar have been delayed to 2029.
The Ministry of Defence today published its tenth annual summary of the defence equipment plan.
The document contains a great deal of technical information about the projects and the management/funding side of them and you can read that for yourself here but the detail on this project is scarce, the document simply makes mention of the decision to “Defer Lewis BMD radar” as part of a cost saving exercise designed to save between £100m to £199m.
Further detail was revealed in the National Audit Office report on the Defence Equipment Plan, which mentions the following:
“Delayed construction of a radar system to detect ballistic missiles (by three years) to 2029.”
This, the NAO say, is part of measures which the Ministry of Defence expects will save £3.8 billion over 10 years, but which will affect military capability.
Back in 2017, the MoD issued a Request For Information regarding radar technology and capability for a new ground-based ballistic missile defence radar system. The information came to light thanks to a question asked in Parliament by Mr Kevan Jones, MP for North Durham:
“To ask the Secretary of State for Defence, with reference to paragraph 4.16 of the National Security Strategy and Strategic Defence and Security Review 2015, what progress has been made on his Department’s plan to invest in a ground-based BMD radar.”
The question was answered by Harriett Baldwin, the then Under Secretary of State for Defence Procurement:
“Since the Strategic Defence and Security Review announcement, the UK missile defence community has been undertaking detailed scoping of the options for the future ground-based ballistic missile defence (BMD) radar. A Request For Information was issued to Industry in June this year to gather information about radar technology and capability. We expect the radar to be in service by the mid-2020s.”
The UK’s current and only ballistic missile defence radar is at RAF Fylingdales (pictured at the top of this article), speculation suggests that either a site in the UK or Cyprus will house the system.
While the radar station at RAF Fylingdales remains a British asset operated and commanded by the Royal Air Force, it also forms one of three stations in the United States BMEWS network.
The other two stations in the network are Thule Air Base, Greenland and Clear Air Force Station, Alaska. The data obtained by Fylingdales is shared fully and freely with the United States, where it feeds into the US-Canadian North American Aerospace Defence Command at Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado Springs.
A land-based anti-ballistic missile would also be nice. i.e Aster 30 Block 2 BMD
That might offend someone.
Ah, America?
A missile still in development designed to counter threats with a 3000km range is hardly of any concern to the US with AEGIS ashore and THAAD.
America will throw a strop if the UK goes Aster.
Nonsense. The UK is a very small market compared to the one available to the US and its other allies. It just doesn’t spend enough for the US to be concerned. For example, Australia has committed to 72 F-35As and the UK has 48 F-35Bs on order with a vague commitment to maybe buy more in the next 10 years. Where’s the beef?
Hi Coll, yes, then upgraded/new stocks of Aster 30NG could (potentially) be shared by the RN and RAF. Nice and sensible, eh? Got to get the T45s sorted and updated first.
These yearly savings seem so small considering the nature and need for this type of ABM infrastructure. Isn’t it kind of needed now, or even yesterday? Forewarned should be forearmed… just that there’s nothing to shoot back with (yet).
Any further updates on the CAMM /CAMM-ER uptake in the RA anyone?
Yeah, and it’ll be save ~£100M now, but spend an additional ~£400M then. Net capital saving = b’gur all, but miss out on the tax receipt from increased industrial activity & employment now.
Plus borrowing is cheap now, but is heading in the wrong direction soon.
What’s new? Almost everything mentioned in that statement carried some form of “delay” caveat.
That report is already history. The military World has changed in as little as a month. Already in Whitehall emergency planning must be underway to shore up our forces with what they may need if the Ukrainian crisis escalates? Uk support for bolstering NATO strategy against Russian aggression will fall heavily on the British Army. I doubt we have the material to be in many places at the same time, but it won’t stop the British Government from continuing to over-commit. One startling shortfall is the number of MBTs available, and what can be done in the short term to up armour and increase countermeasure protection. Sadly, there is only one country that could supply the UK with additional heavy tanks and that is America. I say sadly, as once again, the UK has been found wanting at a critical time and its reliance on the US, due to sloppy planning. One piece of equipment that is needed right now for both political and military use is the good old MBT, regardless of their true strategic value. Any NATO country that falls short of demonstrating a heavy punch will be seen as a weakness by Russia and the greater European public.
So something else slips. Well slap me in the face with a fish, what a surprise.
So…ABM radar slips, not that we have anything to fire at anybody should the need arise; Meteor integration slips; Spear 3 delayed and a subsonic cruise and an anti ship missile in eight years. Wow
Best bring all the ships and aircraft home and start digging a hole for a shed in the garden. Never mind…. all is well with the MOD now they have a Diversity Dept.
time to dig out the protect and survive booklets from the 70s as well do drills on taking doors off hinges in quick time.
Wondering when to paint my windows with white anti-radiation paint!
Yet HMG/MOD still trying to find more defence savings/cuts.
If Putin wants to describe Luhansk & Donetsk as “ancient” parts of Russia he should read his history. Anciently they belonged to the Golden Horde Tatars, Mongols, Cumans, Pechenegs, Khazars, Magyars, Avars, Huns, Sarmatians, Skythians.
Give it back to Uklraine you theif.
Hi Frank, I think Putin is basically wanting to squeeze Ukraine’s access to the Azov sea, it’s renewal of its naval power (with UKs help) and reduce its exports/earning foreign revenues when trading with the rest of the world.
It only takes one little madman to cause so much damage and death. Hope he gets stopped in his tracks, quite literally.
Yes must be stopped. Ukraine will be taken a bite or two at a time most likely unless we step up & stop it dead. CCP is watching becoming more confident about trying to invade Taiwan. Every ambitious despot with territorial ambitions too. Ukrainians died by the thousand fighting for their freedom against tyranical Russian-backed mafia rule.
No more cuts to our forces or capability gaps. This stuff is real, nasty & right now. Our weakness, greed & folly has enabled their boldness. Whose freedom & soveriegnty are we prepared to sacfrifice next for a vaneer of delusional peace while Russia/PRC tears us apart from the inside by cyber war?
Not to mention Azov is one of the most resource-rich seas on the planet.
As Tatar and from tribe that was part of golden horde of the great khan I will happily accept the republics on behalf of Russia 👍
We are having big celebrations now to welcome them
Only because Stalin had those Tartars who opposed him deported or killed.
I’ve got an old steel helmet I can contribute. It is German though.
Quick enough to hand billions to their mates for not even delivering usable PPE etc. Defence of the realm has to wait. We have to rely on the USN & neighbouring allies who have some ABM capability to intercept anything coming at us while dithering about aquiring the capability ourself on the brink of a major European war.
I know I do go on about this but this is back to my argument that we need to choose priorities and stick with them or bang an extra 0.5 per cent minimum on defence.
Sound people must keep banging on until sense prevails. The tragedy is the mad-house defence spending has been over the last 15+ years.
Rely on the US for missile defense? We can’t defend ourselves, much less the UK. The UK gave up on real defense around 1965. 😢
I’m refering to Standard SM-3 on any USN CCGs or AB DDGs in the region plus those on Belgium/Dutch or others near by. We’re very vulnerable to missile attack, many nations hostile have them, even conventional attacks could do rapid extensive damage. We’re way behind many other nations in ABM defence in a very dangerous world.
I’ll second that.
Its a dispute between the RAF and the Army neither want to take on ABM defence or any SAM for that matter. They have been in denial since the 60’s.
Are you serious? The Defence Minister should step up and say this is whoever’s responsibility! If not why not share it? As it’s concerning high altitude surveillance and interception I’d say it would be naturally the RAF but others here might have other views.
Sorry but have to say the RN is the only service that should be dealing with it. They have the kit and know how to deal with it and already proven they have the kit, just need the updated bang bangs. Missile air defence ended when Bloodhound went out of service and the RAF gave up SAM’s. What will they defend the air stations with now? BB guns? Truly embarrassed
30mm/40mm radar laid cannon offer good AA defence and defence against munitions with variably fused munitions.
The solutions to air base local base defence exist on RN ships already.
The only thing is that I do t know if the appropriate radar is on base, don’t think so, and it would need a CMS and weapons controller / maintenance team.
We do have the Giraffe + Ceptor system as well but probably in smaller numbers than we should.
It is much easier to take something that works and is derided and scale it.
Hi Geoff, It would be really good for a change to see something actually brought forward even really early… Lol 😁
Read the detail on Sky Sabre in the report ..p58 ishh. Looks like it’s only being deployed in (is optimised for) the Falklands and is stated as being ‘contingent’ for future general land based requirements!!
Hi Pete.. I have now read this along with some other “bumph” It’s enough to make you weep. Six years more to develop something that we could buy for peanuts on the open market and already have in service.
NOT the time to push this back fellas…
To be fair this requirement is hardly a priority amongst other delayed projects. We have BM warning.
We don’t have BM defence, neither do most other nations.
I’m no expert on the matter but we have flying dales for long range. Radars are already able to pick up a ballistic missile if they are pointed up. The missile is the only thing up that high going that fast.
I can’t see this as a priority. We don’t have anything to shoot at it so it’s a few mins warning which is not much use to anyone except the top tier of government.
Maybe I’m missing something.
Yes, there is Fylingdales. Start of the “4 minute warning” of the Cold War.
A Russian launch would first be picked up on IR by US satellites. BMEWS then confirms it, sends alert warning to the Home Office Warning Liaison officer at High Wycombe, who pass on downwards and outwards.
In the Cold War that alert would then go down to local sirens in various locations, to the BBC, Radio, and so on. There was also a comprehensive civil defence infrastructure, including bunkers, the UKWMO, RAFOC, emergency stockpiles, many many bunkers, and so on.
Mostly discarded in the 90s though some elements remain, but naturally little info is freely available.
The BBC have plans in place, for example, for warning.
Yes. ministers and senior command have a few places to go to, such as the DCMC, and others. Would do them little good to be fair with a direct hit. Dispersal to remote locations would be better.
I read that RAF Menwith Hill has some BMD equipment related to the US / NATO ABM systems in Eastern Europe, but yes we have nothing at present to shoot incoming IRBMs down. Though I read on here from people who know a lot more than I that Sea Viper / Sampson could have some capability?
Correct. The current Sea Viper (Aster Block 1) missile can engage short range ballistic missiles. It will only be able to engage targets up to a published height of around 70,000ft. Which is not enough for transitional medium or intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBM) that fly higher than 100,000ft and exo-atmospherically respectively.
Both the BAe/Thales S1850M and BAe Sampson can detect and track ballistic missiles. The S1850M can track the high altitude exo-atmospheric ones, whilst Sampson can track the lower exo-atmospheric ones. Sea Viper in theory should be able to engage descending one piece medium ballistic missiles in the terminal phase as their speed in general is around Mach 5 or lower, at low altitudes. It is similar with ICBM re-entry vehicles, as they get lower in altitude the denser air slows them down. Where they could be hitting the ground at speeds between Mach 4 and Mach 6 depending on the vehicle’s design and how many manoeuvres it has done trying to avoid defences.
I see it that the main deterrent should get sorted first. Dreadnought.
This is only for radar and we already have the massive flyingdales and are most likely kept in the loop with the Americans systems.
Personally I would add the requirement onto the replacement of the current radar network we already have.
Without systems to do anything about an incoming missile I’m not sure what additional radars are needed for.
I agree with regards to Dreadnaught. However, the problem with Trident is that it’s all or nothing. If some nutter gets hold of an Iranian Khoramshahr-2 medium range ballistic missile and has a grudge against the mini Satan, ie the UK. We have nothing that could intercept it, until it’s below 70,000ft and there’s a Type 45 in the right place! Trident would not stop the launch or give such parties qualms about nuclear reprisals. As they’d know Trident is only for mutually assured destruction against peers Nations.
The Khoramshahr-2 is based on the North Korean Hwasong-10, which has a range of 2000km. If that is the case, it can be armed with 1800kg HE, or a chemical and even a nuclear warhead. The range can be extended using a smaller warhead. Though they’d still need to launch from a ship in the western Mediterranean for example.
It has been widely reported that North Korea are helping Iran develop their ballistic missiles. They have managed to produce a number of rockets with multiple stages to put a satellite in orbit. Which is precisely what you need for intercontinental ballistic missiles.
I’m not saying that Iran would do this, but it has supplied a lot of weapons to supported groups, who aren’t too particular about who they fire on.
A ballistic missile defence would in my opinion be a worthwhile investment. Would it help to defend the Country against a saturation attack? Probably not, but against a small number, fired by some nut job, definitely! Plus it would be the 2nd layer of defence against strike aircraft and cruise missiles.
I don’t see an attack on mainland U.K. from Iran unless we have provoked them a lot and I don’t see the U.K soon that. It would take a lot of U.K. missiles fired from the U.K. for Iran to take that response.
The vast sums of money involved in defending the U.K. from missile attacks would take so much of the defence budget there would be not much left over.
Until we can get tech that can shoot multiple incoming long range missiles additional radars are nice to have extra.
You’ve misconstrued what I was trying to get across. Even the lunatics in Iran aren’t stupid enough to launch a missile at the UK. They know that it would in theory invoke NATO’s Article 5 clause, and give the US the excuse its been looking for. Iran operates its political will through its proxies, such as Hamas, Hezbollah and the Houthis. If such an attack was going to take place it would be by one of these groups or another affiliated to Tehran. Thereby “absolving” Iran from blame. For a ballistic missile to reach the UK from North Africa it will need a range of a least 3000km.
The Fylingdales Raytheon AN/FPS-126 (UHF) Pave Paws AESA radar provides 360 degree coverage and can detect a high altitude ballistic missile 3000 miles away. These are backed up with a number of radars located around the UK operating in the L and S bands, that generally have a range of between 250 and 350 miles. They are specifically for detecting aircraft and unlikely to have a high angle scan need for ballistic missile detection.
Having an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) capability need not break the bank. The AEGIS ashore using SM3 and SM6 is probably the gold standard, followed by THAAD and David’s Sling. I would discount the S400 as there is very little information other than propaganda on the effectiveness of the system. Both THAAD and David’s Sling have been used against real ballistic threats. AEGIS Ashore hasn’t, but the system has been used in numerous trials showing both SM3 and SM6 hitting ballistic targets with the results publicised (even the ones that didn’t work).
We could have something that could protect the UK against medium range ballistic missiles at a half of the cost of AEGIS Ashore, which is around £255 million per installation, whilst THAAD was £640 million as quoted to Japan. This would be a development of the T45’s PAAMS and not the French/Italian SAMP/T system. The radars of the T45 are considerably better than those used for the SAMP/T. Both BAe/Thales S1850M and BAe’s Sampson have detected and tracked ballistic missiles. With the S1850M tracking some high altitude exo-atmospheric targets, whilst Sampson can track low earth orbit ones.
The issue is the Aster 30 missile. It does not have the effective engagement height, being around 70,000ft. As it needs to reach above 100,000ft. So that it can engage the missile (single stage) before it starts to dive and pick up speed. Similarly for released warheads. It is better to hit the rocket before it separates the warhead/s. For example the Raytheon SM6 has an engagement height greater than 110,000ft. With the new larger booster its getting, they say the height should reach 150,000ft and more, so they can counter hypersonic glide vehicles (HGVs).
There is nothing wrong with the Aster missile. It has a better radar than the SM6 operating at a higher frequency. Plus it has the mid-body reaction jets, so the missile can react better to erratically manoeuvring targets. It just needs a substantially bigger 1st stage booster. We already have part of a system in place at Portsdown Hill. That incorporates the T45’s S1850M and Sampson radars along with the PAAMS combat management system, that is used for software trials and training. It would just need the missiles and it would be fully functioning air defence system. To cover the whole of the UK you would need around 4 to 5 sites.
I agree.
We do need some form of missile defences sooner rather than later.
Needs to be a diffuse system so it isn’t just a magnet for first conventional strike.
I was going to ask you about the radar at MWC Portsdown and whether it could be used. Seems too good an opportunity not to?!
Across Europe there are two Aegis Ashore systems in Poland and soon to be Romania and the US forward deploys 4 Aegis Desteoyers ro Europe for ABM defence. Israel no doubt feeds into the wider US sensor net. So in that sense this may not be an issue .
A Tpy-2 radar could be bought off the shelf if needed from the US, q couple of Thaad batteries are out of our price range but its unclear why we need ro fund a bespoke design,
Samson could be tweaked I believe, if only we had a missile….
Buying Pateiot would make sense but that is another matter
You have the Aegis Ashore installations the wrong way round, it is Poland that is due to go live by the end of 2022.
EDIT spelling mistake.
Good question why can’t we use bigger version of Samson with aster weve already paid for development work hard mostly been done
I think Aster needs to be ugraded to be ABM capable. It was mooted a few years ago but appears kicked into the long grass.
It’s not really like for like, but the RAF’s old Type 101 long range radar on top of Mount Olympus in Cyprus probably needs replacing, it must be well over 20 years old and hard worked. The UK was probably hoping that the USA would chip-in, but got no joy. The yanks have their own huge over the horizon radar in Cyprus – PLUTO.
I’m aware the US pay for parts of the costs of infrastructure in the SBAs but I thought PLUTO 1 and 2 were British? PLUTO has two enormous arrays, one for transmit and one for receive, at Salt Lake Site and at Ayios Nikolios.
Yes, the 101 on Mt Olympus is superbly placed. The equipment next door on Mt Troodos just as good, and of equal importance.
You might be right. The Cyprus PLUTO II is definitely US supplied, although located in a UK SBA. Maybe it is RAF or jointly UK/US operated? A quick google brought up an interesting article https://cryptome.org/2012/01/0060.pdf It makes the good point that SIGINT has become much less important than it used to be, also the US’s NSA seems to have developed its own Cyprus facilities to such an extent that they now essentially duplicate the UK’s capabilities. One less lever for GCHQ when doing intel sharing deals with the NSA.
I didn’t know that it was US supplied, thanks.
JSSU (C) operates the facilities at Ayios Nikolios, it also has a det at Salt Lake site ( presumably for the OTH / Sigint side as the other aerials on site include HF comms and part of DHFTS )
It also has other Cyprus sites at Episkopi, ( Pusher array and SATCom GS ) Troodos, and possibly Cape Gata.
JSSU is a tri service unit and part of the JSSO, also tri service. These intelligence units fall under Defence Intelligence and Strategic Command. There are several.
They replaced the RAFs 13 and 33 SU’s and the Army’s 9 Signals Regiment in Cyprus.
Yes, that is a good article I’ve referred to many times. As GCHQ are also located at Ayios Nik you can bet the NSA are also there. Under UKUSA agreement the world is divided into areas of responsibility, the UK took eastern Europe and the Middle East.
Intelligence is widely shared between 5 eyes nations ( with exceptions ) so I don’t think the NSA having similar will effect our sites importance one bit.
A look at GE shows how the site has expanded, including a Torus antenna.
Its SIGDAD code may be “UKM253” and it is codenamed “Sounder”
And all that I’ve outlined is open source.
Cheers.
Thanks for all the info. I visited the SBA’s several times in the late-80s and 90’s – too long ago for my recollections to be either accurate or relevant now.
As we have no means of shooting down a ballistic missile I’d rather not know one was incoming TBH. It’s only use is to give the PM time to hide underground. Tough he/she can take their chances like the rest of us. I’d rather we spent the money elsewhere.
Yes, pretty much my view too. This can be deferred, warning is already in place.
Maybe one day one of our missile systems will have the capability.
Yes I would like to see money on some immediate air defence and short/medium range ballistic missile defence for key U.K. assets as well as for the navy/expeditionary units. Russian naval doctrine seems to be shifting to the idea of long range strikes against key targets and not trying to contest sealanes.
time for an ABM system for the type 45s and say THAAD for key U.K. bases.
We are ridiculouly exposed ccompared with many other, even smaller, nations.
With you on this Jonathan, naval/sub bases, airports, army/logistics bases/key infrastructure, etc. Surely hope there’s enough Sky Sabre units to go around or more in the pipeline. It was mentioned here that the RA was also looking at CAMM-ER? Maybe that’s fizzled out?
Some other related questions: does the Army still have tracked Rapier? If that’s also going what is replacing it? Is there a tracked CAMM being developed as it all seems to be wheeled MANN truck based at the moment? Is there a Sky Streak(ER) being developed for a future Stormer vehicle?
“Surely hope there’s enough Sky Sabre units to go around or more in the pipeline.”
At present just 16 RA, for defence of the field army not the UK, though of course nothing stopping it being redeployed except the army in the field would be near naked! Just like the UK is now.
“Some other related questions: does the Army still have tracked Rapier?”
Not for years and years! It went when 22 Reg and 16 Reg RA were reduced to just one regiment, 16RA, and Rapier FSC came in.
“It was mentioned here that the RA was also looking at CAMM-ER? “
I believe that comment came from C 7ADG himself, so I assume it is still in the pipeline.
No idea on Stormer / Star Streak. That remains an effective system for close AD of our armoured BG as Davey has detailed many times.
‘… will save £3.8 billion over 10 years …’
Does anyone have the figure for savings on U.K. foreign aid over this timeframe? Ought to be quite significant given the recipients hate us and mostly buy their weapons from Putin or Xi with our generous support.
Hope these supposed savings aren’t linked in anyway to recouping for the Ajax debacle…
It will save it until they decide to then spend it after 10 years at a higher price, makes no sense.
Delay is the deadliest form of denial.
Not on topic but very Defence related, sorry George. Listened to Putin’s long and rambling speech explaining why he was ‘justified’ in the de-facto annexation of Lugansk & the Donbass. Serious question, has President Putin gone mad? Watching him it was like a cross between Dr No and the last days in the Fuerer bunker. It certainly wasn’t normal behaviour. I’m pretty sure he has ‘issues.’ If so that is not good having a loon with 6000+ nuclear warheads.
‘
Not taking it for granted Jay. However I think Putin may now be a out of control FRUIT LOOP.
I think he’s a fruit loop that has had some very significant conversations with China. To see Ukraine as an isolated incident would be to ignore what is happening on the world stage. Clearly this was all timed for after the Olympics ( the whole timetable looks to have been in place for a long time, as you don’t move 75% of your military across a continental land mass without a lot of planning). I also think China will be working with Russia on making sure any sanctions from the west are manageable as China will buy all the fossil fuels and food Russia can dig up or grow. I also suspect this will be a model for china’s next move. During the Olympics China has be silent, we will need to see what comes out, I suspect it will be words of support for Russia and something about NATO/western aggression.
I think the leaders of the authoritarian powers have decided now it the time to lay out their hands openly on a geopolitical movement that started a good decade ago.
Very true. Alas the west funded most of this by our desire for cheap fossil fuels (rather than political pain of new nuclear or all in green tech) and by offshoreing so much of our manufacturing.
Sanctions will be a lot harder when Russia can just turn off the gas taps to make Europe’s population freeze.
Im no Russian sympathiser but put yourself in their shoes. How would you feel about a formerly friendly nation that borders on your country and contains your own citizens joining a potentially hostile military alliance?
I think NATO should just deny entry to Ukraine on a permanent basis, why are they needed? We have no obligation to them other than the general obligation to uphold democracy where we can and it seems to me that denying them membership would be the best way to stop them being invaded.
I guess i don’t know the full picture.
Russia and the UK’s defence budget is very similar, but it’s remarkable how poor value the UK gets for its spend compared to Russia. All these delays read like a case study in procurement incompetence
To be fair, yes this is an important part of ongoing infrastructure, but it’s not really going to make much difference as this is more about Intercontinental range ballistic missiles and there simply is no practicable defence against this type of attack.
There are other detection systems for shorter range ballistic missiles, as Russia has a lot of these with conventional warhead options we need to focus on getting a short/intermediate range ballistic missile defence up and running to protect some of our key strategic assets.
trouble is there are a number of other programs that are really needed have been knocked back. This is bonkers. Everything is now pointing to explosive conflict points in both Europe and the Far East. In any sensible age, we would be starting up emergency re-armament programmes no plodding along in a very slow peace time program.
We seem to be in some insane unannounced ten year rule since 2010, while we have two great powers who are essentially on a pathway to war with the west. This pathway is speeding up, Putin and I would imagine China having now watched the Ukraine situation have now decided for a number of reasons the west is now impotent to counter their geopolitical moves.
Publishing a number of delays to programmes on the day Putin has announced UKraine as a nation is a mistake he will now be removing from the world order, is shall we say beyond foolish. if anyone thinks this is not something our enemies will take note is very optimistic.
We need to move away from the sunny days of the last and first decade of the previous and this decade. China and Russia are enemies of the west, we may be able to avoid a general war but that will only be through strength and not pretending we can be friends or appease as that never works. It’s unfortunately time to bring defence spending to Cold War levels and build as quickly as possible, sad but that’s where I think we are.
But we don’t have enough money thanks to the pandemic but national debt pretty much means nothing anymore
What our government actually means by not enough money, is we don’t want to spend any more money on that. In reality we could increase defence spending up to 4% of GDP if we wanted to.
Given every country is basically broke
The only direction they want money to go is offshore into tax havens to benefit the already super rich. Austerity for the rest. Why do you think HMG didn’t bat an eyelid at chucking tens of billions at their mates for covid PPE contracts that delivered nothing of any value to the NHS, but treat the poorest like scrooge’s mean grandfather? Trouble is many of those don’t care a fig for our freedoms or welfare, just keeping their businesses & gravey train rolling. Some honest ones have been saying “tax us more, it’s embarrasing” but our Tory masters only serve the big money.
Soon we’ll either become history, succumb to our own putin/Xi backed puppet tyrant or have to spend rapidly to try to defend our way of life.
For goodness sake stop reading Labour ar*e licking newspapers and spouting the same crap on here in every post.
Virtually every country bought PPE that wasnt suitable in the mad rush that was at the time to procure equipment, any old crap that was laid about in China’s warehouses got sold under the pretext it was suitable.
Treat the poorest badly, hang on has the delusional press you read already made you forget about the furlough scheme? What about the uplift in Universal Credit to help the poorest through a very hard time?
Lets also not forget military spending has been uplifted also despite the massive costs of the pandemic.
2029 is not good enough, especially when we are likely before the week is out to be at war with Russia
Not being a seuth sayer But will we still be here in 2029?
If we are not nor will St Petersburg or Moscow, so I’m hopeful. Unless Putin has gone mad for MAD (see above).
Russia seems to think battlefield tactical nukes can be used. (Tongue in unamused cheek now)We seem to have a cunning plan to make our forces so small they’ll be hard to find & so badly equipped to not make it worthwhile!
It was just a little case of Beware the ides of March Rob
In the last couple of hours Putin has announced Russian recognition of the Donetsk and Lugansk.regions as “independent” states
A statement apparently issued by the Russian Embassy in London, said Putin signed decrees recognising independence of Donetsk People’s Republic and Lugansk People’s Republic, as well as treaties on friendship and cooperation between Russia and DPR and LPR.
The decrees on recognizing the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics order the Russian armed forces to go into separatist territory on peacekeeping missions
It seems that the Russians have begun their 2022 Schlieffen Plan. President Biden will respond by being beastly to them with sanctions. Once the gas supply has been cut off, we can all look forward to breaking up our furniture to burn and cook on.
Just because Putin has made these decrees, this doesn’t legitimise this at all. Hope the Ukraine and West/UN will call him out on this land-grab. I bet China is watching from the sidelines to see for the West’s reaction.
At this point, I wonder if any politicians are regretting that they kicked the new nuclear can firmly down the road? Similar in Germany with the decision to turn off their nuclear power plants.
Sanctions would be a lot easier if so many European nations wernt beholden to Russia for gas/energy. (Similarly to China as the factory to the world)
Hope the courage is found to step back from the brink before lives are lost.
Germany should be called out for its utter stupidity in buying gas from Russia, both the UK and US both warned them the NS2 would be used as a political weapon, and even more so with Russia’s history with threatening to cut of supplies to Ukraine and hacking into Ukraine’s power grid.
I agree though, nuclear power is the best option and should be proceeded with, regardless of whether environmentalists like it or not.
Yep I agree it always was – To think in the 80s we had leading Nuclear power and clean coal tech industries…..still Thatcher put paid to both of those.- Now we have to get the Chinese & the French in
Nord stream 2 has now been used as a weapon by Germany. They aren’t turning it on anymore. For the time being.
Putin has being trying to protect his country from incoming sanctions for years now. He has a vast foreign currency and gold reserve. These will only last so long though.
I imagine he had prepared that bro’s stream 2 would be kept turned off and thought it’s worth it
More delays
Sorry it may be controversial but the amount of money we spent and lost shielding a tiny percentage of the population against Covid is now coming back to bite us. And it will be biting us for years to come.
Why do we need this? We have no missiles that are capable of dealing with a balistic missile and so we are just able to watch as the missile heads our way. Effectively this is part of the US missile defense, but surely they should be paying for it not us.
Don’t get me wrong I am not anti private enterprise etc, but our defence budget is not about defending the country, it’s about putting as much money in the hands of the shareholders pockets of the defence contractors, many of course will be politicians, civil servants and their circle of friends. It’s a system designed to waste taxpayers money. We are told extra 16b on defence yet we are saving 100 million to 199 million on probably one of the most important defence requirements. The fact they cannot pin point the “saving” within 10% questions the honesty of the statement. It’s just an excuse to make a “saving “now to pay defence contractors even more later on. Defence is never an issue at election time because politicians do not want to spoil the gravy train!
What UK defence system will stop a cruise missile fired from a sub, say off the shore of Ireland?
I am a big advocate of the uk having a ballistic missile defence system that can cover Europe not just the uk and given todays events and the threat of sever reprisals the decision to delay the basic missile defence we have ( we can’t actually defend ourselves at range) is looking more short sighted.
We need a system that can intercept at a 1k mile range as the outer layer with a tighter mesh the closer to the uk it gets, eventually having camm ER or better securing our borders and major defence sites and infra.
first thing we have to do is protect our military so they can fight, AAD is therefore a high priority in my view.
Surely in the light of latest nuclear threats from Putin, UK’s cost saving exercise could be a gross miscalculation. Surely this defence system should be an absolute priority?