HMS Prince of Wales heads to open waters for sea trials

1) – Canberra Class is a Navantia design and build (the hull was built in Spain and shipped to Australia for fit out only) – We’d be dealing with the Spanish not the Australians.
2) – Trieste is far more capable as an F-35 platform, higher top speed and better aviation capabilities.
3) – Agreed we’ll get no more than 2. But in addition to the Bays, Point Class and 2 x LSS its a very good amphib capability. Add in an Argus replacement and its good.
4) Trieste was $1.2bn, the Canberra Class are $1.5bn.

Add in that the Trieste uses the twin island design, RR MT30’s like QE and T26, better, larger elevators, is larger and faster than the Canberra Class and doesn’t use Azipods which the RN has previously rejected and I’d say that the Trieste is definitely the model we need to follow. Add in that the Italians will have run F-35 and Merlin ops onboard making introduction to RN service vastly simpler.

I wouldn’t actually base any F-35 on them permanently, as its unlikely we’ll have enough. But when 1 of the QE Class are in refit its a useful additional capability to have especially for training when the carrier is away from home. Additional deck space is always needed.

Hehehe

I agree, very hopeful times indeed. Even if the adoring crowds at the entrance to Downing St had been orchestrated by Alistair Campbell!

I didn’t know that – takes the gloss off somewhat but still heady days.

I know, felt a bit upset by that myself when I found out. The kings of spin…spun themselves out of power!

Balls…it was an international banking crisis!

More balls…even Thatcher was talking to the IRA…during and after the Brighton bombing.

Thatcher was PM, she had to. Corbyn was not PM, and therefore had no need. Simple realy, no matter what justification.

Peace in Ireland is a matter for all elected British and Irish politicians. As is every other issue affecting the people of this country. So Corbyn isn’t PM…therefore he should take no interest in the NHS, the economy, unemployment, international relations etc etc. The only thing simple about it is your one-eyed interpretation!

Total garbage, and if you think he is right to justify the IRAs methods and reasoning, which he has, then you are pretty sad, and again try to stick to the subject, his talking and arse licking to the IRA gangsters, not go off on a typical lefty tangent and ignore/justify/excuse what you don’t like being spoken about.

“not go off on a typical lefty tangent and ignore/justify/excuse what you don’t like being spoken about.”

Is there a ‘typical’ ‘righty’ tangent ? Just asking for the sake of balance.

Right and Left is a distraction in our politics, I accept its where we are and its not going to change any time soon if at all but there’s no need to paint yourself into a corner, I used to do it myself, pick a side, but why ? Things change, I can’t help but think some people have replaced religion with politics as something to be dogmatic about and use as an excuse to give ‘the other lot’ pelters.

I dont do corners, I go with policies, not out of date blind allegiance. I voted Labour in 1997, have voted Tory, and in local elections voted for our local Lib Dem councilor on a number of occasions, as he understood the needs and issues of a military community. I dislike the lickspittle, toadying and self righteous attitude of many on the left.

Corbyn is just an old figurehead, a back bench protester who would support a dog turd if it disliked this county, it’s institutions and history. He is just a means to an end for the more dangerous members of the left to gain the reigns of power. Labour at the moment is a disjointed, second rate bunch of politicians, who by there absolute incompetence as a main opposition party, will ensure the Tories remain in power, no matter how bad they become! As a working class man, with a family, I see the current Labour Party as traitors to the working man.

I’m no fan of Corbyn, far from it but he’s just as opportunistic as BoJo and a load of others in Westminster. Party politics has blindsided them, or at least they play to it for their own selfish ends, probably both.

I’ll not delve into your hyperbole about Corbyn, amusing as it is, as I say, he’s no different to the rest, just coming from a different angle.

It’s not hyperbole as it’s not an exaggeration, it’s factual and can be confirmed with even a basic bit of observation and enquiring.

I’m sticking with hyperbole, “support a dog turd…. etc”. When talking about politics this stuff doesn’t help, it just polarises the debate and cranks up the rhetoric giving someone on the other side of the argument the go ahead to be equally shitty back and so it goes on.

Andy P, the majority of the country has gone to this immature way of thinking that one side is right the other is wrong.
It appears that the art of discussion and compromise has deserted the popular narrative.
One only has to read some of these forums to see that some people believe they have to win a meaningless arguement rather than hear an alternative point of view.
Thanks for being a voice of reason.

I think it’s a combination of the internet making it easier when you don’t have to look someone in the eye as you’re telling them they’re an idiot or whatever and our ‘betters’ in parliament don’t exactly help. They’re constantly taking cheap shots at each other and making out they’re being noble about things.

I agree it’s all a bit saddening and doesn’t add to debate. It just lets people get their rant on.

It has always been polarized, and the last 3 years has just proven how much, and our disgraceful MPs behavior and antics goes to show the absolute disdain they hold the electorate in.

Yup, life is easy when its black or white, good or bad but that’s not real life despite all attempts to make it so.

I agree that our MP’s have shown more concern for themselves than the electorate, 3 years to get Brexit sorted and some are moaning that they’re losing a week… BoJo, Reece Mogg etc trying to scupper May’s deal because they preferred their own version only for some like Reece Mogg to change his mind at the last minute…

As I posted elsewhere, Corbyn spitting his dummy out and not meeting Trump, its not about you Jezzer, you’re supposed to put the ‘greater good’ before your own views and prejudices…

Then if you throw in the Party over constituency there’s another dynamic that ‘our’ MP’s have scope to give a stiff ignoring to the people they’re supposed to represent.

God, its bloody depressing.

Damn good post, now I’m depressed mate lol! And with our system of first past the post, in regard to general elections, the number of MPs can be disproportionately representing a very low number of voters, but that’s another issue to get depressed about! Lib Dems wanted that changed but I’m sure they have changed their minds on that as well as everything else, depending on the direction of the wind! Time for a brandy……..

The first past the post system allowing a party control on about 40% of the vote is why (even though I voted remain in the referendum) I’m so hacked off that parliament have tried to hamper Brexit. Its not often we get a yes/no vote that gives a clear (albeit not massive) majority but they’re happy enough to call the shots on a majority of MP’s as opposed to a majority in the country.Even that gets ‘tweaked’ from time to time to suit too.

Aye, it seems the Lib Dems are now happy to go with the flow, seeing as how they seem to think they’re going to get a majority. This place needs emojis, assume I’m doing a ‘LOL’.

On my second glass of rouge Airborne, a boy needs something to get him through these dark times…. Slainte.

The only good thing about all this chuff is that it has got a lot of people to sit up and take notice about politics! However it may also confirm, what many of us already know, is that we are here to be used, abused and then ignored by our so called elected reps, if our needs and demands don’t meet with theirs! Although today in parliament was most amusing, listening to the attorney general, who seems like a bit of an attack dog when he needs to be!

And im waffling politics to you, but im the first to moan at others for raising politics flags on here! Although I am aware politics and the military, and the military industry are irrevocably linked! But I do try to keep it to the subject matter, but alas, I have failed!

Aye, we’ve drifted well off the military reservation recently, in this thread anyway its gone mostly politics. I guess now more than usual it will come to the surface.

I’ll shut my pie hole on it.

I should do so as well……….

Don’t worry, I think Corbyn is more concerned about Tom Watson nowadays mate. I mean, deputy leader, ah, they don’t want that, they just want a “dear leader”.

Don’t disagree with any of that. I was merely referring to the optimism of the time. Didn’t work out too well in the end!

That was down to the electorate! I am sure that Gordon would have loved to have been still in power to pick up the tab! But, let us not forget, it was ‘Porky’ Cameron that wanted to cancel them but was told that it would actually cost more. Don’t you just love the selective memory’s of tabloid press readers?

Absolutely, Labour are responsible for every misfortune anyone has ever suffered! You didn’t play the Colonel in Apocalypse Now by any chance?