F-35 jets launched from HMS Queen Elizabeth took part an exercise alongside Israeli and Italian jets.
According to the U.S. Air Force, F-35s from four nations came together in a large-scale exercise in Italy, during which the fifth-generation fighters will fly alongside several fourth-generation jets.
“Falcon Strike 21 is a joint multinational exercise with participants from the United States, Israel, Italy, and the United Kingdom. The exercise optimizes the integration between fourth-generation and fifth-generation aircraft, increases the level of cooperation in the F-35 logistics and expeditionary fields, and strengthens interoperability of allied and partner air forces during joint operations.
This year’s exercise is hosted by Italy and will provide multinational forces the opportunity to test and improve shared technical and tactical knowledge, while conducting complex air operations in a multinational, joint force environment. Amendola Air Base is the main operating base for Falcon Strike 21 and all training scenarios will take place in Italian air space.”
U.S. Air Force F-35s from Hill Air Force Base, Utah, and F-16s from Aviano Air Base, Italy, are flying in exercise Falcon Strike 21 at Amendola Air Base, Italy, June 7-15. They will join U.S. Marine Corps F-35Bs, along with F-35As and F-35Bs from the Italian Air Force, F-35Bs from the United Kingdom Royal Air Force, and F-35Is from the Israeli Air Force.
Additional participating aircraft include the Italian Gulfstream G550, F-2000 Eurofighter Typhoon, Panavia Tornado, AMX International aircraft, Alenia Aermacchi T-346, and MQ-1s.
The Italian-hosted exercise “will provide multinational forces the opportunity to test and improve shared technical and tactical knowledge, while conducting complex air operations in a multinational, joint force environment,” U.S. Air Forces in Europe said in a release.
We should not be conducting training exercise with an Apartheid state that it’s jets slaughtered children and civilians in Gaza! I can’t imagine the awkward unease our forces are put at by this reckless government.
Hardly an apartheid state! Israeli Arab citizens have the same rights as Jewish Citizens. Hamas however have no democratic credentials in the areas controlled by them since Israel unilaterally left Gaza back in 2005, they don’t have elections and tend to murder opponents and drag their bodies through the the streets tied to the back of motorbikes.
Imagine a world where the Palestinians unilaterally laid down their arms. Peace in the Middle East.
Imagine a world where the Israelis unilaterally laid down their arms. The Arabs would storm the country and purge them from the Middle East in a brutal genocide.
Amen to that!
There are no Jews in Palestinian controlled lands but there are Arabs in Israel. That shows who oppresses whom.
Well the several hundred rockets Hamas launched in the first place was hardly a peacefully intended was it?
4000 – launched indiscriminately, largely against civilian targets.
Every Israeli counter-attack was aimed squarely at Hamas. Moreover, Israel calls the target beforehand to warn of an incoming attack. If you live in that block you get a phone call. If you don’t move-out they drop bangers on top. Then, if you still remain they bomb the target.
No other nation on Earth goes to such extremes to avoid hitting civilian targets. The problem is Hamas doesn’t care about civilians and happily uses them, knowing it is useful propaganda if a child is killed.
Here we go. Ugh
We already help build the F35 for Israel … so suck it up and see.
James have the tactics of a Marxist,protecting the Nazi regime of Hamas.
In fact all evidence points he hates Israelis and uses Palestinians as tools..
Like Communists unions sabotaged British defence industry until 22 June 1941 as Sir Charles Goodeve of “Hedghog” fame says in his memories, and remembering Soviet Union offered Basis Nord for Nazi submarines to operate and strangle England…
Maybe James can explain how Hamas have more rockets than British Army when he said they are unarmed…
Of those fired against Israel 10-15% fall in Gaza before reaching the border.
So James obviously does not care one iota about children and civilians of Gaza.
The use of civilian homes for rocket firing and Hamas tunnels being build with children work is also not part of his repertoire…
Notice he did not even talks about Israeli civilians.
James,
From a military point of view, Hamas kick started the latest conflict by launching 150 missiles into Israel on the evening of the 10th May. over the next 15 days they launched over 4600 missiles including 10 Iranian supplied Badr 3 missiles which has a 250kg HE warhead. In return the IDF carried out 1500 strikes inside Gaza resulting in 256 death. Now we are often regaled to the fact that Gaza is one of the most heavily populated areas in the world , and yet a death toll of 256 after 1500 airstrikes is relatively light. I mean VBIED take out hundreds in one go. only the otherday a explosion inside a Al Shahbab base where they were building one resulted in over 61 deaths. so to arrive at 256 deaths after 1500 airstrikes means that the IDF are pants at their job, they are using duff ammo or they are targeting the Hamas and IJ operatives. Oh just for the info it was revealed yesterday that the Un found a tunnel running under one of their schools in Gaza the other day:
https://twitter.com/galberger/status/1403035946367455232?s=20
It’s all kicking off now, Spanish jets have attacked HMS Albion and Turkey shot down one of our Wildcats and blamed it on Russia and no one is listening
Very boring now, try a different tac.
OK Dude, as you wish.
What’s your favourite Bird ? Is it the Chuff per chance 😂
Is that a bird, a chuffin? But like a puffin but cheaper……😝
Israel is an illegal occupying power per numerous UN resolutions since 1967 annexation of the West Bank, Gaza, the Golan Heights, and part of Southern Lebanon. By its illegal settlement activities, per again UN resolutions supported by most of the nations of the world that includes EU, UK, USA etc., Israel has effectively created an Apartheid state in the said occupied territories in the West Bank, and by isolating Gaza and depopulating the Golan heights of their Arab populations.
The results on the ground are no different than pre 1992 Apartheid South Africa with its then “Bantustans” policies. Like those policies, Israel has imposed heavy restrictions on the movement of the Arab populations within their creatwd Bantustans (Arab enclaves), bad services (healthcare, education, housing, social amenities etc.), and most egregious of all, punitive and often deadly so called anti terrorist raids by Israeli I security forces that results in hundreds of Palestinian civilian deaths a year.
Let’s not make excuses for Israel. Even the “certified” Arab Israeli citizenry in Israel itself, is fed up with the essentially racist and second class citizenship they are subjected to within Israel. The recent riots in Lod, Tel Aviv, Jerusalem and other Israeli cities during the recent Hamas rocket attacks clearly shows the state of current Arab Jewish relationships within Israel is far from satisfactory.
Israel’s implementation of Zionist (I equate it with Apartheid) policies has effectively killed the two state solution of Israel and a Palestinian nation living side by side that was envisioned in the Madrid Accords. In my view, the only viable soution now is a single state solution, and if that is to occur in a democratic dispensation of one person one vote and majority rules, then the Zionist vision of a dominant Jewish state is no longer feasible, as demographics are consigning the Jewish element of population to that of a minority.
The demographic dynamics at play is global. Ethnically homogenoius political States are going to be a thing of the past by the end of this century. Attempts at gerrymandering so that political power is retained by traditional dominant ethnic groups within a polity is doomed to failure. This is true be it in China USA, UK, EU, Scandanavia, Russa, South America, Afica or anywhere else.The smart way forward for the current powers elites is to accept the inevitable and learn how to navigate their nations and peoples into the coming “brave new world.” Even within the “First” world nations major demographic shifts are taking place that will have major impact on their wealth and wellbeing of their populations.
Time to get real, Israel I am afraid, is not sustainable as Zionist (by this I mean the currently desired ethnically pure Jewish nationalist) State. Without a major change in policy the results of the Israeli Palestinian conflict is going to be catastrophic with major repercussions for the rest of the world, especially those who support and sustain Israel without questioning the policies of the Israeli State.
Israel is an important military ally. That is not going to change any time soon. So exercises will continue.
That is only going to stop when all of Israels neighbours + Iran stop wanted to destroy the country.
Again why do they want to destroy the country of Israel. Ask yourself this in a dispassionate manner and I think you have your answer. I help you bit with the process. Say if all the Arabs suddenly disappeared then off course the desire to see Israel’s destruction disappears. However, since that scenario is unlikely, the question is, what is it about Israel that makes its destruction in its current form so pressing for the “Arab street”? Note that prior to 1947 the various Muslim communities (Arab, Turks, Persians etc.) In North Africa and the Levant (Middle East, Turkey, and Persia) hosted for a millennia large Jewish populations whom they treated far better than how the Christian communities of Europe treated their Jewish communities.
I submit to you and others in this forum that the dislike of Israel by its neighbors in the Middle East is less to do about religious differences and more to do with the ‘”colonial ” approach to Statehood that underpins the Zionist state that is Israel. If Israel was to become a democratic state like the UK encompassing the Palestinians, Druze and others in the geographic space of what under the British colonial mandate was Palestine and the TransJordan, the only agitation we will see in the peoples of the new state would be around the same issues we see in the UK, essentially socio-economic opportunities and outcomes. Agitation in my view then becomes more about class and less about ethnicity.
You’re reading too much revisionist history. You’re talking nonsense from a secular perspective and failing, like all liberals, to respect the cultural, religious and ideological difference different people group truly have.
You talk inclusively but you superimpose your interpretive framework on them. You apply your value set to them and build arguments from your opinions to justify why someone else should behave like you want them to. This is Western cultural imperialism at its heart and this is why all Western peace initiatives have failed.
Frankly, and please excuse me but I find this kind of talk deeply offensive. Differences matter. Culture is important. A people’s narrative is fundamental. Their history, their religion, their beliefs, their philosophies define them. To erase these as though they’re a rounding error and reduce everything to Marxist tropes is ugly and abusive. It frustrates me in the extreme. I don’t agree with our Arab friends’ beliefs (and they are friends) but I sympathise with them when Western secularist just discount their identities as though they don’t really matter. They do.
For instance, all those bombings of Mosques in different areas of Iraq previously weren’t just politics. They were directly related to prophecies around the return of the Mahdi. In short one group by attacking another was trying to prevent his return to those candidate return, locations – thereby empowering those groups. This really matters.
I don’t disagree that by improving their economic conditions there would be more peace but let us be clear Hamas has been spending its aid on rockets. It had a choice how to spends hundreds of millions – it chose bombs.
Branaboy wrote:
When Jordan was formed in 1921, it banned Jews from living there. At a stroke all the Jews were expelled from the country. This was repeated in the West bank in 1949 after Jordan captured and annexed the West Bank and East Jerusalem, In fact the so called ethnic cleaning of Palestinians from Sheikh Jarrah is due to how Amman used Israeli land bought by jews in 1875 to build homes. Since 1967 there has been a dragged out court case which settled the case on the basis that those living there would pay rent, they haven’t and so the people who own the land took them to court and won the right to get their land back.
Similar expulsions were seem across the Islamic world with a lot before the birth of Israel. Even then 1 day after Israel came into being, the fledgling state was invaded by 7 Arab nations , whose rallying call to the Palestinians in their path was get out of the way and return when we have pushed the jew into the sea. The problem was, they lost.
1967… when Nasser attacked Israel.
As did Jordan and Syria. It will be a cold day in hell before Israel give back the Golan Heights.
I beg to differ, yours is a false narrative. Israel in 1967 carried out what Moshe Ryan the then defence Minister of Israel called a “preemptive strike”, which means Israel attacked first to prevent what Israel claimed was a pending attack from the Arab States. Off course it is imposed to prove this Israeli assertion.
More chuff, please refer to my first reply.
Moshe Dayan..
Unfortunately the UN peacekeepers were ordered to withdraw by Nasser from between the waring factions. I read that Soviet intelligence gave duff info about Israel massing on the Syria border to Nasser who removed the peacekeepers and he started a blockade of the Straights of Tiran. The next day Iraqi troops and Eqyptian troops came into Jordan. Both sides mobilised. Given how Israel were surrounded this was tantamount to declaring war.
So you go figure what you would do if you were Israel.
(In fact Egypt were planning to attack Israel a few days prior, but Nasser was encouraged by the Soviets to cancel it. The Israelies knew about the plan.)
I see you miss the chance of bombing Galileia from Golans,
That really shows your type and what about you care.
In a typical Marxist setup you hate that Jews – now conflated with Western Civilisation – have a country of their own.
But strangely you do not have any problem with “Arab” countries.
Corollary Jews are not permitted auto-determination. I am sure if they would be extolling the great Socialist ideas that would not happen and the narrative would have changed…
Let’s compare:
The Balkans changed borders and territories ownership by violence and we are talking about 1990’s not even 1960’s, same for many other countries after 1970. But those are not a problem for you.
Why don’t you talk about all peoples in Middle East that don’t have countries of their own but don’t support genocide like Palestinian leadership? Assyrians, Yazadis, Kurds, Druzes, Zoroastrians and many many more?
You know that only in Israel can exists temples of Baháí faith – a religion from Iran- Gardens in Haifa, because they would be destroyed in Islamic lands?
I don’t know what you see in my narrative that makes me a Marxist. Your little narrative about the Balkans actually proves my case. A hegemonic Serbian regime in Yugoslavia was overthrown and is now confined to a small portion of what was once the greater Southern Slav nation that was Yugoslavia.
On the various ethnic groups striving for homelands in the Middle East that you list, you again make my point for me that ethnic hegemony in the current National states are unsustainable and thus the solution is either a true non ethnic based democracy or fragmentation and destruction of the current ethnic hegemonic states. So what I say about Israel also applies same to the Arab States with significant other ethnic minorities.
Even more chuff, once again I refer you to my first reply.
Wow, all that effort could be replaced by a single word, chuff! Lots of effort, good paragraph size, punctuation ok, but content lacking. Please research subject then you may get a C minus if you work harder.
In all your responses to my earlier postings you keep saying “Chuff”, not sure what you mean by that but so far you have not refuted anything I have said. If you believe my historical narrative on the start of the Israeli occupation of the Palestinian and other Arab territories is inaccurate then I will simply ask you to do a google search on the 1967 June War and you will find that all accounts state that Israel initiated the war with a “Preemptive” attack on Eqypt and and the other Arab state because, as I said earlier above, the then Israeli Labor government stated that they believed Egypt and the other Arab states (primarily Syria), were preparing to attach Israel, not that they had attacked Israel.
I think you have a cherished position on Israel, nothing wrong with that, but please do not change the historical narrative to fit your cherished position. I personally have no axe to grind with Israel or Israeli, I actually have a very good business working relationship with Israel in my professional life. However facts are facts as far as historic timelines are concerned. My position on the current state of the Israeli occupation is in line with that of the UK government and the International community namely that the occupation of the Arab territories annex by Israel in the 1967 war is illegal (see UN resolutions 242, 338 and half a dozen others since 1967).
On my views on the way forward, that is an opinion. You are free to disagree about my assertion that a non Zionist democratic unitary state (one state solution) is now the only feasible solution to bringing peace to the area due to Israel’s settlement polices that has made a viable Palestinian state not possible, and thus putting and end to the two state solution that was supposed to have been implement after the Madrid – Oslo Accords but which Israel, with USA tacit suport, renegade on under the leadership of Netanyahu.
“Twitcher” 🤔
Brababoy,
I noticed your post about Israel. Now I am not going to talk about politics simply your point about Israel carrying out a preemptive strike based purely on claims that the Israelis feared an attack.
Actually the Egyptians under Nasser had plans to do just that which is why countries which counted Egypt as a mortal enemy (Morocco/Libya/Saudi Arabia/Tunisia) had sent forces to Egypt Even Syria sent forces to back up the Iraqi tank brigade that just happened to based inside the West Bank when hostilities started) Combined they numbered 900 combat aircraft ,5000 tanks and 500k men
On the other side of the coin the IDF could muster 275K men, 1100 tanks and 200 aircraft. The general mood inside Israel was of fear, knowing that the end could be near, the thing is they didn’t know exactly how close they were with that assessment
President Nasser had set in motion a plan (designed by the Russians) to strike first and this he set about to do with his own preemptive strike for the morning of the 27th of May 1967 (11 days before the IDF carried out theirs) codenamed Operation Dawn.
However hours before everything kicked off and with Egyptian pilots sat in their aircraft ready to go, Dmitri Pozhidaev the Russian ambassador to Egypt woke up Nasser and informed him that the Americans knew of their plan to attack Israel and if Washington knew then so would Israel. This was by a twist of fate reinforced by a IDF training exercise vehicle move of 500 vehicles through the port of Eilat heading west opposite the Egyptian stronghold of Kuntila which was exactly where the IDF had broken through in 1956.. Nasser rushed to his supreme headquarters and told Amer (defence minister) to cancel the strike.
the rest is history.
Thank you Mr. Farouk for your thoughtful input. Yes there was a lot of sabre rattling from Nassar in the months leading up to the June1967 war, and yes there had been a number of border skirmishes with Syria in the North. However the historical records do not shpw any intensions on the part of Nassar or the Russians to attack Israel. I will provide with with just 2 links to 2 well researched authors on the matter that. In fact a Google search on the matter of the “preemptive” strike in June 1967 come to the same conclusion that Eqypt was far from ready to attack Israel and the Soviet Union was actively pushing Nassar to calm down.
https://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/07/04/israels-attack-on-egypt-in-june-67-was-not-preemptive/
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/blog-post/did-the-soviet-union-deliberately-instigate-the-1967-war-the-middle-east
Branaboy,
Many thanks for your reply and the 2 links, On reading them I find the latter simply states that Russia wasn’t keen on war and shocked the Egyptians by stating that they weren’t a match for the US. Nowhere does it state that Egypt wasn’t for war, if anything the reverse is true.
The first link cites the Book Six day war by Michael Oren as the definitive reference point on the six day war and the author of the article states:
(Also cited in the first link you provided)
which is what is written at the start of the chapter, is completely overruled by what is written on the next page:
Chapter Sunset on Dawn page 119. So how the author can claim that Nasser had no interest says to me he didn’t read the next page as I.
Damn my photos didn’t come through last time:
next page
last page:
The book:
Please review this old article in the Foreign Policy Journal that I had linked in my earlier post. This an other historical analysis agree that Egypt was not in a position to attack Israel in June 1967. Even Yitzhak Rabin the Israeli Sinai commander of the time conceded that in his memoirs which is quote in the link. Mr. Oren has his viewpoint which is at variance of Rabin and other Israeli Generals from the era. In 1973 Egypt was clearly the aggressor but most dispassionate historical analysis of the June 1967 war generally accept that Bazaar was sabre rattling but was clearly not in a position to go on the offensive. I think that viewpoint comes through in my two links.
https://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/07/04/israels-attack-on-egypt-in-june-67-was-not-preemptive/
Thanks again for a thoughtful exchange. I will take a deeper dice into Mr. Item’s book.
This debate is entirely off topic but with regard to the demographic dynamics, the countries with the highest standards in just about everything, all have low birthrates whereas those at the bottom of the heap have runaway population explosions as do many of their descendents that have migrated elsewhere. So if mere numbers are to dictate our future then…
Make of that what you will.
You are right that it really is off topic with regards to the subject of joint military exercises in Italy. I only wrote what I did when MR. Newell and others went after the first poster Mr. James with what I considered to be inaccurate remarks.
For me Israel’s participation in the joint exercises is very welcome. That however does not mean we must accept incorrect statements. Maybe Mr. James should not have used the word Aparthedi in discribing Israel, but he is not wrong in discribing what pertains on the ground in the occupied Arab territories.
Sorry if I have upset you or others in the forum. That is not my intension. I enjoy reading the postings that more often than not are very informative. I very rarely contribute because I am more often than not in learning mode.
Hi Branaboy. Thank you for your gracious post and absolutely no apology needed. I am one of the worst offenders when it comes to straying off subject, although I am trying to reform 😀. I am very much on the same page as you all round regarding Israel
Kind Regards from Durban
The UN is about as much use as a chocolate fireguard. I “served” under UN control, as did many American friends of mine. We all share the same opinion. Your antisemitism is noted.
Standard charge made by all those who are unable to legally justify Israeli behavior. We either accept the international rule of law architecture instituted by the USA and at its victorious allies in the post WW2 era or we have anarchy. All nations must play by the rules as generally formulated under UN auspices (with the USA and Europe having general formulate and pushing for global acceptance of these rules).
Israel was attacked and nearly obliterated from those territories. Which ever nation, having defeated the belligerents then returns the very strategic lands from which those attacks were launched? It would be suicide. But that’s exactly what people want.
And let us remember, the West Bank was well known as Judea and Samaria for thousands of years beforehand and is the home of famous Israeli places like Bethlehem and Jacob’s Well. The name “the West Bank” was only adopted in 1967. Rather like the term “Palestine” it is used to de-legitimise Israel. The term Palestine was created by the Romans after they invaded Israel, murdered the inhabitants of Jerusalem, sacked the city, and drove the Jews out of the land. The Romans then, having forcibly exiled the majority of Jews around the Roman world renamed the territory in the hope of obliterating the memory of Israel. The very term, is the embodiment of violence and anti-Semitism. And rather like it, the West Bank is used to disconnect 5000 years of Jewish presence in those lands and delegitimise their right to exist.
So, yes, let us get real – Israel is the ONLY, Jewish state in the world and it is tiny. There are over TWENTY Arab states and they’re all bigger than Israel. How many of those Arab states let anyone, other than Arabs gain citizenship – very few and it takes years and is an immense struggle. And anyone who has worked in the Middle East knows that they’re racist in the extreme and hold the lives of its migrant work force in very low regard. So, why do we not hold said Arab states to account but seemingly and myopically focus on Israel and its wanting a territory for Jews. Yes, its racists. But so what. They’re surrounded by racist states that want them dead and have the money and numbers to buy the West’s silence.
The problem is, people have deified multi-ethnic, multicultural states. Ok, that’s their choice but it only a choice. It isn’t morally good. There are no moral obligations for anyone to adopt this stance. We have, but who are we to demand others conform to our opinions?
The solution is for Israel to annex the rest of those lands and pay the locals to move to any of the other twenty Arab states which surrounds them. Given the price of David’s Sling and Iron Dome etc. it would probably be a economically viable solution in the longer term.
Now, let us bring this topic closer to home. IF demographics continue as is and the UK becomes a Muslim majority nation in the next fifty years and then democratically has the power to enforce Sharia law – would you stay, would you accept this new settlement and what about your children? It is easy for us, separated by thousands of miles and fifty years of demography to condemn Israel, but they live day in day out with this impending reality. They have been ethnically cleansed more than once and likely don’t want to go through it again and thus are taking the step they consider necessary to protect their race, their culture, their land and the future of their children. Given their neighbours’ 1600 year, ideological hatred towards them, today written in the charters of Hamas, Hezbollah and Iran for instance, what choice do they have – realistically?
Your first sentence was wrong. Israel has never annexed the West Bank or Gaza and is still officially hoping for a two state solution. In 1967 Israel offered to give back the Golan to Syria for peace. The offer was rejected by the Arab League summit in Sudan, when it declared the “three Nos”. No peace with Israel, No recognition of Israel, No negotiations with Israel. That doesn’t amount to an annexation. Syria’s attack on Israel through the Golan in ’73 (Yom Kippur War) was too devastating to be allowed to be repeated. The effective annexation of the Golan (in all but name) took place in the 1980s after Israeli hopes of an independent Druze state in the area could not be implemented.
That was just basic corrections to sentence one. You could have found all this out in seconds through a browser search or even Wikipedia. Next time I suggest you try it. I imagine if I bothered to read the rest of your rant it would have a similar level of accuracy. So I won’t.
Daft question but where are these spare f35b’s coming from, I thought they were on QE or training in the UK.
I suspect the Uk and USMC f35b are indeed from QE given that the carrier is offshore the big boot at the moment…just a wild guess..