RAF Typhoon fighter jets are set for a significant upgrade as a result of an £870 million contract awarded to BAE Systems and Leonardo UK.
The deal, underpinning 600 UK engineering jobs, will provide Typhoon jets with a world-leading radar system – the European Common Radar System (ECRS) Mk2.
“Supporting the Government’s priority to grow the economy, this contract sustains 600 UK engineering jobs in Edinburgh, Luton and Lancashire,” highlights the press release. The new radar system will be placed in the nose of the Typhoon, marking a new era for the aircraft’s operational capabilities.
The radar will initially be integrated onto RAF Typhoon Tranche 3 aircraft and will also be available for other nations operating the aircraft, giving a boost to UK defence exports.
The investment programme, totalling £2.35 billion, will sustain around 1,300 UK engineering jobs over the next decade. The £870 million contract specifically will provide jobs for 300 workers at Leonardo’s site in Edinburgh, 100 electronic warfare specialists in Luton, and 120 engineers at BAE Systems’ site in Lancashire.
Defence Procurement Minister, James Cartlidge, said, “The RAF Typhoon is one of the most mission ready and capable aircraft anywhere in the world helping protect our skies at home and abroad. This £870 million contract award is an investment in the future readiness and preparedness of our fighter jets, so that we can continue to showcase our world-leading air capability.”
A prototype of the ECRS Mk2 is currently undergoing rigorous testing at BAE Systems site in Warton, Lancashire. It is expected to start initial flight testing in 2024, marking a critical milestone in turning the prototype into a fully operational capability.
DE&S Director General Air, Vice Admiral Rick Thompson, added, “Developing ECRS Mk2 not only provides cutting-edge capability but crucially, also ensures that advanced technical skills and expertise in delivering complex sensors are available to support the Future Combat Air System (FCAS) right here in the UK.”
Overall, the Typhoon programme contributes £1.4 billion to the UK economy annually, supporting over 20,000 jobs across all regions of the country.
How many airframes will get this upgrade and is this another variant, thus reducing frontline strength even further by denying the improvement across the fleet?
At the moment the plan is for all the 45 tranche 3 aircraft to receive the new radar. With the possibility of some of the tranche 2 aircraft being updated.
Knowing the MOD they will use it as an excuse to not update the tranche 2 Typhoons and withdraw them saying that the 45 updated Typhoons are sufficient until the Tempest enter’s service.
Until unmanned aircraft (assuming they are cheaper to buy) become the norm the RAF will have to struggle on with less than 50 Typhoons seems a daunting prospect. Let’s face it, we will be lucky to see 30 Tempest. The MOD know aircraft technology is on the brink of huge advances with the greatest emphasis on drones of all sizes and functions. Even Tempest will be flown remotely by the time it retires, so estimating future aircraft mixes and fleet numbers should be one hell of a headache.
Oh I wish I had a crystal ball like you… we do NOT know how many Tempests we will get. Plus the F35 has a very capable radar and will get Meteor this will make them a very capable air defence asset.
All bets are on Rob N, but I’d be surprised if it’s more than 30. Some of my reasoning is the advanced aspects of Tempest that will determine the fleet numbers. In the past, jet fleets were in the hundreds, today around 80 airframes per type then the new generation of planes considerably fewer. The same goes for the American’s new designs with modest numbers being banded around for the Raptor and B1 replacements based on enhanced capabilities.
However this is a joint project with international partners also ordering the jet. So it is possible that there will be economy of scale. So we will just have to see. Fleet sizes have reduced but there must be a point that covers the capability you need with the order numbers.
We had better get a lot more than 30 Tempest. Let’s not forget the RAF/RN are reducing the F-35 buy to ~70 or so aircraft (down from the original 138) to help pay for Tempest. If we end up with 30, then that’s a double kick in the teeth!!
Of cause, you may be right David but if the other partners buy a similar number the total figure, plus any exports, could still make the programme viable with just 30 for the RAF. I’m basing my assumption on costs and pilot training and the continuation of Typhoon operation through to the full-service capability of Tempest.
Actually the idea behind Tempest is actually to manufacture in a similar way to Gripen. The software is broken into blocks, so that you don’t need to completely rewrite the code every time you update something or add an additional weapon for example. With Typhoon and F35, that’s not the case. It’s hugely complex and time consuming to change anything (and therefore expensive). Furthermore additive engineering is already being used for new build Typhoons and will drastically reduce wastage in the build. All of that adds up to a much reduced development and manufacturing cost as well as lower operating… Read more »
Very interesting BobA thanks. I’m still of the opinion the RAF Tempest fleet will be modest even though the methods of manufacture are streamlined. The mindset of Westminster, regardless of party is to restrain Defence spending, which since WW2 has been savage regardless of major MOD cock ups. Tempest will be fully supported politically but like all defence projects it will suffer from cost spiralling that will taint the enthusiasm and stir political debate. When that happens the cost axe quickly does its worst.
When you read of how the banks are refusing services to defence companies because they are ‘unethical’ you begin to realise we have a huge problem of disaffection in this country. The Universities are allowing this stuff as well as the garbage on the net.
The problem is the flipside to pacifism is subjugation and murder on a huge scale. Not only the horrors of occupied Europe in WW2 but the misery of the Ukrainian war should be at the forefront of those who put personal feelings before the plain truth, that we live in a dangerous world.
Point taken about the drones etc. but I’m guessing that in reality it is the design costs that really hit the budget. You might as well go for a decent number and double it.
RAF has 40 Tranche 3 and 67 Tranche 2
The ECRS Mk2 AESA radar still won’t be operational until the end of the decade, but it will be an incredible radar with it’s electronic attack capability. Current plans are for 45 Tranche 3 airframes to get the upgrade, but many RAF officers want the Tranche 2 to also be upgraded.
The RAF should still be in the SEAD game, which would give operational planners additional flexibility.
Cartlidge can say what he likes about “mission ready” but on any one day there are only 55-60 airworthy Typhoons with trained pilots available.
That’s not what “reducing frontline strength” means.
On a slight tangent, last week the cream of Defence Journalists had a Jolly at Warton,in particular Hangar 5 to see what progress was being made on Tempest – to say they were impressed would be an understatement.
I hope so, the RAF really needs a win with Tempest.
They should be impressed!
“The battlespace in which air forces will operate in the future continues to change and evolve.
To meet threats we don’t even yet know about, we must create a next-generation air combat system which is agile, flexible, connected, rapid to update, and affordable.
Tempest will bring a ‘plug and play’ approach, where software and hardware can be easily changed in and out depending on the capability and functions needed for a mission. That could be different kinds of weapons, sensors, or fuel tanks.”
LINK
Yes, I was reading on Twitter. I’d love to have a look in there!
It’s certainly very impressive 😉
Back to being silent…
LURKER!!!! 😉Good to see you post, mate.
Anyother details on the event?
Posted below 👇
I was more the lines of articles and photos. But thanks. Minor observation. The team tempest looks like something that would be more aligned with a silhouette of an NGAD aircraft.
Reading about the visit it was made clear that any Photography was strictly prohibited so can only really go on what was written . .
No worries. Thank you for the information.
Another snippet – https://twitter.com/RAeSTimR/status/1675898556803170305
Seems really sad that typhoon will only reach its full potential a few years before being scrapped for Tempest. With flight test in 2024 that suggest 2030 at the earliest for wide scale adoption, also suggest we could keep the tranche 1 going with the same upgrades as Spain up to 2030 at least.
Tempest really should have been an evolved Typhoon porting the latest version of typhoon equipment in to a new low observable body but now it’s sounds like everything thing will be developed from scratch.
An interesting read – https://twitter.com/FTusa284/status/1676578223201697793
2030? Is this April 1st? Not the remotest chance!
I don’t think typhoon will be going out of service that quickly after 2030. Tempest will take time to get numbers up, training tactics etc. They will probably be still around 2040-45.
This radar is probably what will end up in tempest and variations, development of the tech used etc.
The constant development of fast jets is very important to keep the skills going that allow the U.K. to stay ahead of the game.
If the F35 hadn’t been picked we may well have seen typhoon development go in different directions.
RAF Typhoon in varying numbers will be in service well past 2040. It could take 15+ years to get Tempest capability (whatever that will really look like) in service. Typhoon had been in RAF service for 14 years before project centurion to integrate StormShadow, and Brimstone was given the go-ahead. Eurofighter are looking at Typhoon being in service until 2060. And F35 in service into the 2080s.
£875m is actually quite cheap for an upgrade of this magnitude.
The per unit price is quite affordable.
But I don’t think that is the full cost per frame as the rest of the systems are also upgraded.
I suspect with T2 even more bits will need to be replaced.
Thank god we have a massive defence budget to keep them flying. “WASHINGTON — Lockheed Martin’s F-35 engines are being overworked and could lead to an extra $38 billion in overhauls in the next few decades to help cool radar and other components of the fighter jets, according to government auditors. “The cooling system is overtasked, requiring the engine to operate beyond its design parameters,” the Government Accountability Office wrote in its 91-page annual report released Tuesday. “The extra heat is increasing the wear on the engine, reducing its life, and adding $38 billion in maintenance costs.” Unless there is… Read more »
But in the background there’s the Lockheed, P&W, GE battle on the next engine. SO lot of numbers thrown out there atm to support, lobby and put pressure on politicians to get a new engine or upgraded engine for the f35 depending on what camp you’re in. It could in reality be a non story because will you fly the f35 all day long using everything at its maximum, radar, processing power, sensors etc ? No, most flights in peacetime will be not using all the cooling capacity hence very language ‘engine overhauls might come sooner’ Remember the GAO has… Read more »
Time will tell. “WASHINGTON — The Pentagon expects that an engine upgrade offered by Pratt & Whitney for the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter will be ready to field in fiscal 2030 and officials hope that all customers — foreign and domestic — who fly the jet will pitch in to fund its development, according to a spokesperson for the F-35 Joint Program Office. “The projection to complete the engineering and manufacturing development phase and required testing is seven years from the start of the pre-Preliminary Design Review activities, which began in fiscal year 2022. Fielding is expected to begin soon thereafter,… Read more »
You can see this is far from over, P&W accusing Lockheed of undermining the NGAD program.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/war-over-future-of-f-35s-engine-explodes-publicly
Indeed, I posted this at the time.
I see BAE are looking to upgrade the Typhoon with more computing power, could see the EJ engine needing upgrades to cope with future enhancements.
https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/air-warfare/bae-systems-future-proofs-typhoon-with-tranche-5-upgrades-and-gcap-synergies/
Tempest may come into service in 2035 more realistically a few years later and probably over a 15-20 year production run , tranche 3 Typhoons will still be about in 2050
Tempest is a Technology Demonstrator which will inform the FCAS programme and just as happened with the predescceor of the Tyhpoon, the BAe EAP, it will take longer to deliver results and what comes after is still very much up for grabs. Another pan European solution is probably most likely (and affordable).
Typhoon took so long due to the European partner nations being difficult. Had it been a solo U.K. project or perhaps Italy things would of progressed much faster.
The current partners of Japan and Italy I think is good for tempest. Sweden is part of some sections of the programs as well. If anymore want to join they will need to show what they bring to the party and what they expect to get out of it.
Thing is move fast and break things rather than agonising over perfection forever. A biggish platform with plenty of power and space for ‘stuff’ with excellent stealth is where sense directs and reading between the lines this is what is going on. T31 style get an upgradable platform out there with margins for growth. Sure there will be crazy stories about why we didn’t integrate A / B / C but if you want to be everything you get an excruciating unit price and it is so slow into deployment that it is dated. We do at least have sovereign… Read more »
Agree get Tempest out as a baseline standard that is still world class then spiral development of platform and capabilities. The RAF should invest massively in Tempest. If the UK can get 150+ jets in service and rebuild frontline strength, that is exactly what is needed in these dangerous times. A huge investment by the RAF will ensure confidence in sales for partner nations and likely lead to overseas sales …..to friendly nations we can trust eg Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, Australia, New Zealand….maybe, Canada etc etc. The UK also needs to keep the Yanks at arm’s length as they will… Read more »
Tempest will have plenty of room for Avionics and Weapons – from what was said about the Warton visit it is Big – possible length is 24m/80 feet.
That is what is to be hoped for….
Tempest is not a technology demonstrator, it’s the core aircraft of FCAS. The ATD is the technology demonstrator. The GCAP partnership to produce an aircraft is already concrete.
The RAF already has the smallest fighter forces of the larger NATO countries and is heading to be the smallest very soon of all our allies. We may have some extra tech. but you can only have one aircraft in one place at any one time, Rather like ships.
As we see Russia has a huge fleet but being able to use them effectively with properly trained people is much more valuable than just numbers.
Oh well. Let’s cut the RAF to four Squadrons then.
Yet it is still the RAF that can deploy capability overseas and sustain it when other nations with supposedly superior numbers cannot.
See my response to M.S. You don’t have to constantly defend the RAF when something is obviously wrong, not with the service but procurement.
And you don’t have to constantly criticise when all commitments are being met and more. The Typhoon force has global deployments. And is doing an outstanding job. Only the US can better what we are doing.
I thought we had got over this Robert but obviously not. You have once again responded to two of my posts without presumably reading them. I didn’t criticise the RAF in either. For some reason you have a belligerent attitude towards anything I say so I suggest we call it a day. I will respond to you no more.
If you comment, you have to expect it to be challenged. MS replied to you with a perfectly valid point. Numbers aren’t everything, as Russia is demonstrating. And the RAF is much better prepared than you think it is. Otherwise, we couldn’t deploy Typhoons to Eastern Europe and Norway, To RAF Akrotiri, Still covering Op Shader over Syria and Iraq. QRA North and South, the Falklands det and still maintain a full exercise program around the world, and still have capacity in the force. I just try to keep things in context against the doom sayers.
The question is sustainable action I suppose? I doubt the RAF could sustain more than 12 aircraft now on enduring operations. Three squadrons on a short operation perhaps, but that would strain the remainder to the max covering UK commitments. The fact is the RAF should never have been allowed to fall below 12 fighter squadrons, but really useful aircraft like the Jaguar GR3 and Harrier GR9 fleets were culled, killing 6 very useful squadrons in one go. The problem was ‘dramatically’ compounded when the Government withdraw the entire Tonka force without replacement …. An act of utter bloody madness,… Read more »
We do actually have mid 30’s F35B in service now. Coming up to 36(?) by the end of the year and then quite rapidly up to 48 over the next two years.
IRL for UK purposes F35B is the right choice. T2 Typhoon is better than F18 and T3 is much superior.
To be fair SB, you’re quite right, but even with two active F35B squadrons ( mainly anchored to the carriers), we are way down below critical mass…
They appear to be on RN duties about 20% of the time – just like the old joint Harrier force…
I agree. There is also merit in what Robert says regards capability and availability, but numbers are so so low.
Both Labour and the Tories are responsible for that.
Totally mate…..
I don’t know if you read the twitter feed from Francis Tusa i posted above but he made a comment that might offer the faintest glimmer of light regarding future Typhoon orders.
True: but it is more fragile than it should be as pilot training is a total mess.
Yes, the RAF fast jet numbers are alarmingly low and Tempest can’t come fast enough.
By comparison by the end of 2023 the RAAF will have 72 F35A, 24 Super Hornets and 12 Growlers in service – all up 108 fast jets all recent airframes and each one already equipped with advanced AESA radars.
Plus a confirmed order book for 13 Ghost Bat ‘loyal wingman’ UAVs with an in service date of 2024-25. Supported by 6 E7 Wedgetails and 7 versatile boom equipped MRTT tankers.
The RAAF procurement policy is text book
‘how to equip an Airforce’.
An excellent force mix, the only mistakes being the tardy, fragile European Helicopters that it’s now divesting itself of.
Not to mention the new assets for SIGNIT/ELINT (Perigrine) and ISR (Triton) about to come online.
The RAAF can effectively match the RAF capability for capability and weapon system for system including cruise missiles (if not in outright numbers) and will have niche capabilities including maritime strike (currently Harpoon with NSM and LRASM on order) plus dedicated SEAD/DEAD (AGM88 Harm with AGM88G ER on order).
I read somewhere the other day (apologies it was on here, credit wise), that the RAF has NATO commitments covering the equivalent of four squadrons of Thypoons and one F35! That makes me laugh, so basically 80% of the RAF capacity could be asked by NATO to deploy to let’s say Greece, that would be fun, what’s left to defend UK airspace, a strongly worded letter??? You couldn’t make this up, but even though mass continues to fall, they compound it by having small fleets within fleets, no doubt we will do the same with F35, a few getting APG85… Read more »
Comparisons of squadron numbers can be misleading. The RAF seems to operate fast jet squadrons with as few as 12 airframes while the RAAF typically follows the USAF model with 24 per squadron.
Hence why 72 F35As will only constitute 3 squadrons.
I guess squadron count helps justify why the Chief of the RAF holds the rank of Air Chief Marshal while the RAAF Chief of Airforce is ‘only’ an Air Marshal.
Our whole mindset is wrong John. Not one of the services is capable at operating at anything like it’s full potential. It doesn’t take a brain surgeon to work out what’s wrong. It’s screamingly obvious but can the politicians sitting inside the M25 moat see it. Of course not.
Absolutely mate, they just don’t care, our mass is gone across all three services, with no urgency (or even desire) to rebuild any of it…
They make me😡
Good news some contract money has been put into the program. The tech developed for the radar has many more applications not only in defence. When someone says where does the defence budget go this article is a good example. There does need to be a balance between numbers and tech and getting that right seems to be difficult. Turkey and Greece have large numbers of kit out how well would F4 do against typhoons? M60 tanks against challenger 2, javelin etc. In recent months there’s been £100s of millions for river class support, typhoon support and so on. There’s… Read more »
I don’t know where 45 comes from the RAF only has 40 Tranche 3 Typhoons, so £870m for 40 aircraft is nearly £22m per airframe. The risk in this is the RAF start to use the fleets within fleets argument it’s presently using against the 30 tranche 1s against the tranche 2 further down the line.
Is this really an essential upgrade or a nice to have?
I’d say essential for UK Aerospace Industry, nice to have for the RAF.
No mention of ISD. Looking elsewhere it would seem to be 2030.
Always good to think ahead! “BAE Systems has stood up the new FalconWorks division within its Air business to explore “what comes after the next”, the head of the new unit, Dave Holmes, told Janes and other defence media at the company’s Warton site on 3 July. Holmes said the new unit, which was stood up within the company earlier in 2023 but which was announced to the wider public on 10 July, is to be an advanced agile research and development (R&D) centre for the Air sector of BAE Systems, delivering a range of “cutting-edge” combat air capabilities to the UK… Read more »
The future of RAF: 36 Typhoon Tranche 3 & 72 F-35B. Tempest cancelled and an order placed for 48 F-35A to replace the Tranche 2s. Red Arrows withdrawn, as not enough T2s to cover. The UK armed forces are decreasing in size. No future UK govt has the appetite to increase defence spending. Russia haven’t demonstrated we need to increase defence spending. Anything else is just hype.
Curious to understand how, having gone through a lengthy process to bring Italy, Japan and potentially Sweden on the Tempest journey, we would tell them we are walking away……and what would that mean for companies in the UK with significant investment in Tempest/GCAP?
Taking it a stage further, such a move would basically be the death knell for a UK combat aircraft manufacturing capability – would that mean significant job losses across the UK?
How can a country, that can only afford just 70 F35bs, expect to design and develop a cutting edge 6th generation fighter? A country that right now, couldn’t even deploy a full complement of fighters on 1 of its 2 carriers.
Probably in the same way that said country managed to fund, develop and introduce not just one, but 3 new bomber types (Vulcan, Victor and Valiant) whilst rebuilding shattered infrastructure and its economy after WWII.
So I ask again; why would the UK cancel Tempest when it has gone beyond a purely national 6th generation programme into a true multi-national activity?
You have a point – finance is probably the largest hurdle in bringing Tempest to fruition.
Israel is also a major factor. They will not go without a 6th generation fighter. The US will not let the UK sell them a 6th generation fighter. The US will will expert the NGAD to Israel, UK and Japan. Italy will join the euro program.
The US didn’t export F22 to Israel, so why would it export NGAD? And why would we buy NGAD if, as you suggest, we couldn’t afford Tempest? And more importantly, why would the UK, Japan and Italy put their own aerospace industries at risk of closure, with the loss of thousands of jobs, just to buy an American product that may turn out to be horrifically expensive, and like F35 not ours to modify?