On June 7, 2023, the UK’s Minister of State for the Armed Forces, Rt Hon James Heappey MP, issued a letter to Tobias Ellwood, Chair of the Defence Select Committee, offering insights into Russia’s heavy bomber fleet and its nuclear stockpile.
In his letter, Heappey emphasised the readiness of Russia’s bomber aircraft, stating, “Russia maintains a number of bomber aircraft at constant readiness at various airbases across the country.” Moreover, he noted that despite some of these bombers being engaged in the ongoing conflict in Ukraine, it is “highly unlikely that this significantly impacts Russia’s nuclear readiness or response capabilities.”
When questioned about the numbers, Heappey indicated that Russia has around 80 aircraft, mostly Tu-95 BEARs and Tu-22 BACKFIREs, under the command of Long-Range Aviation (LRA). Furthermore, he disclosed, “Russia also has approximately 10 each of Tu-160 BLACKJACK and MiG-31 FOXHOUND.” The MiG-31 FOXHOUND, in particular, is tasked with delivering the hypersonic AS-24 KILLJOY air-launched ballistic missile, one of the so-called “invincible” weapons announced by President Putin in 2018.
Heappey also tackled the issue of new production and modernisation of bomber aircraft. He stated that Russia likely harbours intentions to “build new and modernise existing TU-160 BLACKJACK airframes.” However, he cautioned that due to economic and supply issues stemming from the conflict in Ukraine, any modernization projects could face delays.
Regarding the development of a stealth bomber, Heappey revealed, “Russia has announced its intention to produce a stealth bomber, called the PAK-DA.” He likened the design to the US B-2 strategic bomber and suggested that a prototype may be close to completion. However, Heappey maintained a cautious tone, stating that there is “little to corroborate this” and that sanctions and ongoing military events in Ukraine could impose further delays.
For those looking to stay abreast of developments in Russia’s nuclear forces, Heappey recommended two publications: ‘Russia’s Nuclear Weapons: Doctrine, Forces, and Modernization’ by the Congressional Research Service, which can be accessed here, and the ‘Nuclear Notebook: Russian nuclear weapons, 2023’ by the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists, available here.
The UK really needs a large conventional cruise missile stand off capability to deter such attacks on us. Sure our SSN are fine but can only fire a handful of missiles. Our Typhoons only carry two storm shadows. We could build a strategic bomber/ arsenal drone able to carry large numbers of storm shadow or FC/ASW. We should also look to retain our 800 storm shadow missiles as long as possible. They are still one of the best weapons on the planet and are only just completing the SPEAR IV upgrade now. They will be useful for decades to come… Read more »
It’s not just that. There needs to be a way the UK can respond to an attack if it were attack using a singular nuclear weapon, that is more appropriate and proportional. Regardless of invoking NATO’s Article 5, would it be right to use a US asset like the B61? Would the USA let us have one? We cannot really use Trident, as that would be a wasted asset. I’m pretty sure you can program the Trident’s 7 out of 8 (4 out 5 depending on which press release you read) MIRVs to remain inert. But then you will loose… Read more »
My understanding is that some of our tridents are configured with one warhead to be used as a tactical weapon, the war head is dilable.
The key is the survival of the platform after delivery of that single SLMB as well as the fact the enemy would not be able to differentiate between what sort of attack it was. So are you going for a number of MIRVs with the payload dialled to max or is a one small tactical strike, the enemy would very likely err on the larger strike side and retaliate back…. the other bit is detection and security of the deterrent..it is possible that the US or china would detect the launch and may have assets in play…remember if Nuclear weapons… Read more »
But to the Russians, that is a SLBM coming in. They will not know its yield, and will respond in kind. And the position of the SSBN is negated.
Which is why I agree on the need of a tactical nuclear option.
True but at the moment we don’t have any nuclear weapons on cruise missiles. So we can fire large numbers of cruise missiles at Russia and they will know its conventional. If we fire a single SLBM they will also know it’s a single shot and guess it’s tactical likely in response to something they did. It will give away the position of the submarine but then it’s not like the Donkeys have any ASW assets in the North Atlantic these days. B61 would be the other option but would require F35A purchase. That’s very doable if we drop Tempest… Read more »
Hi Jim. A single Trident D5 SLBM carries multiple MIRVs, so they won’t know it’s a one shot conventional warhead we’ve just used giving the location of our sole CASD boat away, so I still don’t support it. No ASW assets in the NA? I believe they often have SSN looking to find and trail our Bombers, just as we, or more likely the USN, do theirs. There were several alerts that made the papers a few years back, NATO MPA from Lossi, and frigate activity. No doubt cued by Dam Neck via the IUSS network. If the tac nuke… Read more »
Daddy is done giving you nuclear weapons. You sucked off of that nipple for the last 70 years.
Oh dear failed the US citizenship test again for the US? Never mind keep trying.
Tempest seems to be picking up pace at the moment. “Testing of components and systems intended for the Tempest Future Combat Air System (FCAS) Flying Technology Demonstrator (FTD) is accelerating at BAE Systems’ Warton site and at the facilities of partners companies around the UK. Work on the demonstrator was announced in July 2022 by UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace, with a declaration of intent for it to fly “within five years”. Industry executives and senior Royal Air Force (RAF) officers working on the demonstrator told Janes and other defence media on 13 June that a big element of this early effort… Read more »
There are concerns Russia may have considered dropping nukes in the North Sea. So no or minimal loss of life but big hit on infrastructure and economy, thoughts being it could be difficult for NATO to come up with a response. Fits their doctrine to escalate to deescalate. Of course NATO could go full article 5 and there will be posters who say of course that would be the case. But WWIII because nukes were dropped in the sea, not sure every NATO member would be convinced. Hopefully we won’t ever need to contemplate a response. But that said apparently… Read more »
The easiest option is to do a deal on ASMPA.
Rapid Dragon type system would be one less expensive option. Surely not beyond our capability to develop something similar
Your last paragraph is interesting, I think Taranis project was around 170m with research, so most of the research has been done. Its certainly possible if we don’t gold plate and use off the shelf systems either existing military or commercial. Blended wing would give good lift characteristics depending on size the RR-F130 would be good as its already hardened, produces good thrust, economy and will have low maintenance cost due to numbers in service. Are you thinking embedded engines or if the service ceiling is high enough podded but on top of the body or between canted tails? So… Read more »
Hi Expat how’s Durban? There have been a number of studies in to Blended Wing Body (BWB) aircraft. Aerodynamically they can be around 40% more efficient in generating less drag. Some studies have shown they can be closer to 50%. As a prime example of an efficient design, the Silent Aircraft Initiative SAX-40 is a good contender. It was designed to generate as little noise as possible, whilst being significantly more fuel efficient than a standard design of airliner. It does this by merging a lifting main body with high aspect ratio wings. Then burying three high bypass turbofans in… Read more »
I would say keep the design simpler and leave engines above the fuselage. The reason to increase manoeuvrability would be to change the scope to include military cargo where there a potential to do some aggressive manoeuvres on approach and take off. Keeping the scope to stand off missile truck and IFR with reduces the need to have more manoeuvrability. However the design would be suitable for a commercial use so the investment if done right could create 2 products. Using off the shelf components where possible would make the aircraft maintainable using exist MRO capability. It also ticks another… Read more »
The UK has single tactical warheads on its SSBNs for just such a task. F35 is also nuclear capable. You could fit a small nuke to storm Shadow. I would also like to see a UK land based SAM system capable of stopping Hypersonic and cruise missiles. Perhaps based on ASTER 30 1NT and block 2 will an additional local defence for key sites provided by Sky Sabre.
If someone used a nuke, no matter how small, against another nuclear armed nation, things would rapidly escalate to full out end of the world territory. We would need to create a full country umbrella defense system but even the US hasn’t been able to afford to do that. The cost would be insane even if the tech was there to shoot them down, which is uncertain.
Could be launchable from the P-8s and future taranis type drones.
It is my understanding the P8 posidon is capable of firing a range of stand off missiles purchase a few extra of those.
Them old bombers won’t get far without being spotted .
True but many of their weapons can be Launched from very far out, the UK lacks a response between hitting an enemy with a half a dozen tomahawks or a trident D5 missile. Large scale conventional strike like Japan and Australia are moving towards may increasingly become a deterrent capability. It’s also one that can be used to potentially disarm a nuclear adversary. We will have a pretty hefty store of storm shadows soon and building a large drone able to deliver 16 at a time is not that hard. It’s also the kind of thing you could fly into… Read more »
You must be forgetting about the UKs airstrike on Syria a couple of years ago, when long range missiles were launched from international airspace in order to avoid the perceived range of the S400.
My point: what will you do when they are not in protected airspace?
That’s why we have F35.
The US is looking at what they think they’ll require to get the job done. “WASHINGTON — The U.S. Air Force repelled a Chinese invasion of Taiwan during a massive war game last fall by relying on drones acting as a sensing grid, an advanced sixth-generation fighter jet able to penetrate the most contested environments, cargo planes dropping pallets of guided munitions and other novel technologies yet unseen on the modern battlefield. For years, Air Force officials have portrayed the F-35 as the aircraft that it would use to infiltrate into enemy airspace to knock out surface-to-air missiles and other… Read more »
“The US Department of Defense (DoD) will in July stop accepting deliveries of aircraft equipped with Technical Refresh-3 (TR-3) hardware and software, four months after resolving another delivery freeze. “Starting later this summer, F-35 aircraft coming off the production line with TR-3 hardware will not be accepted (DD250) until relevant combat capability is validated in accordance with our users’ expectations. The JPO [Joint Program Office] and Lockheed Martin will ensure these aircraft are safely and securely stored until DD250 occurs,” the JPO said in a statement. “Aircraft with TR-2 hardware/software will be delivered as planned. The government and industry team… Read more »
Hopefully the Type 31 will give another credible strike option as a lower level deterrent or response as well as the T26…any RN task group would end up with a reasonable number of MK41s and the enemy will never know what they are hiding.
They would get close enough if escorted and in enough mass. Kinzhal could reach anywhere on the tiny UK land mass in seconds. UK has no defence against it.
Escorted with what? NATO has bases that would allow Typhoon to shoot them down as they were taking off. The donkeys can barley get a tanker in the air. More chance do them getting a Kinzhal by smuggling it in to London in a suitcase than firing it from a Mig 31 or TU 22.
Kinzhal put a Patriot out of action in Ukraine. The escorts would be Mig-31/Su-35 long range fighters. The problem for the UK is it couldn’t generate enough sustainable mass with it’s fighters.
Have you a Kinzhal calendar with tissues and baby oil?
🤣😂🤣😂 very funny. The Ruskfascists wonder weapons. Year right. Very unscated. If the Russian weapons were that good they would have defeated Ukraine by now. The fact Russia is on the back foot and having to defend is a clear sign Russia’s weaponry is neither good enough or available in sufficient quantity to do anything other than annoyance attacks.
I think the issue for the Russians would be that any bomber attack on the UK would have to go past Finland, Sweden and Norway (and the NATO air mission in Iceland) before it even gets into the UK FIR. And unless it was a complete surprise attack akin to Pearl Harbor, we’d almost certainly have a NATO naval presence in the North Atlantic or even Arctic Ocean. It’s not like it’s just the UK by itself in isolation.
Given the levels of NATO/US/UK monitoring that is not likely to happen.
These things have the RCS of a block of flats.
Finland, Sweden & Norway have decent airforces. They are also unlikely to allow the UK to get hit (real world interests as opposed to pure treaty stuff) as they depend on UK for conventional support in many areas.
Not necessarily. Tu-95 and Tu22Ms taking off from around the White Sea would head due North towards the Artic then turn towards the Atlantic. If they get past the Greenland/Iceland gap, there’s very little to detect them, let alone stop them. They could very easily approach the UK from the NW/W and not be detected. We do not have any long range radars that look West. This is why The UK were suggesting the Republic of Ireland agree to have one set up there.
The U.K. has never suggested that, and if the U.K. wanted they can still easily build a station in County Derry if they wanted to.
Hi Mark, it came out from a debate in the Irish Parliament over allowing RAF aircraft to overfly Ireland. Where it was mentioned that the UK had approached Ireland about them getting there own long range radar. Though I do agree a long range radar in County Londonderry would fill some of the gap. Though it would be better situated further south along the west Kerry coast.
I’d like to see that link to be honest as generally the U.K. doesn’t comment at all on Irish defence matters to the point of refusing to state from their side what the terms of the agreement for the RAF overflight actually are. The debate on the procurement of Primary Radar has bounced around more than once but I can’t recall any reference to any formal comment by any government on the matter (of the record comments are different of course). Even then given any system isn’t likely to be connected in any direct way to the U.K. C&C it… Read more »
I remember it quite well as were in Dublin on holiday last year. The debate was on the TV in the bar about the justification of allowing a “foreign country” to overfly theirs. Most people I spoke to about the debate couldn’t care less. They did ask why there was a need for the RAF to fly over the RoI. Which I happily explained. Which came back with a fair enough, are we paying for it? Where I said the UK already pays for it and with no charge to the RoI. Got a pint out of it, so happy… Read more »
You seem to be conflating the issue of RAF overflight with the Primary Radar issue, again I would like to see any direct link to a statement from the U.K. over the radar issue, because as I’ve said the U.K. tends to stay very silent on the matter. The Radar has been floating in the background for decades at this point with no suggestion of any interest by external nations. As to the actual question of Radar procurement, I really don’t get where you come up with the idea that the U.K. or others would be involved in funding it… Read more »
No not all, the Irish Parliament were debating why the RAF were overflying Ireland. Where the Defence Minister mentioned he’d been approached about the radar requirement. Why would the UK/NATO want a radar in the West of Ireland? Well that’s quite simple. There is a huge radar coverage gap and it’s in the UK’s and NATO’s interest that this gap is closed. I’m pretty certain the RoI can afford an AN/FPS-117 radar at around $15M for the basic version and around $43M for the newest version. The question is if RoI did get the radar what would they do with… Read more »
The Minister was approached by defence companies following the 2015 WP about Radar systems with unsolicited RFIs effectively, not by any government, not on the level that he would state in the Daíl, where in the same debate the government has tied itself up in knots trying to avoid admitting the RAF deal. And it has been made repeatedly clear from the government parties and SF as opposition leaders that there’s not going to be any NATO integration. Whether the U.K./NATO would prefer a connection to the data or not, there’s been no suggestion of any coordination of that sort… Read more »
Rockall?
I wondered about that, jokingly. It’s far too small & too low. c25 by 31 meters at sea level, 17m high & tapering as it rises. AWACS probably the best option.
Yes, just joking. Maybe we could get the Chinese to extend it 🙂
Used to be one of 11 Groups at Bishops Court I recall?
Up until the late 70s but given it’s position surely the rest of the island would have limited its detection capabilities?
Yes, curious position, possibly a legacy site from ww2? Don’t think it was in an elevated position either, though I know intell types also used the place.
Yeah it’s an old WW2 base, though given how many others the U.K. had in NI of the same vintage I still wonder why there? I mean would have thought the North coast or as West as you can go in Derry would have made more sense than on the East Coast? It’s not like there weren’t other options, hell maybe have asked the US to try and help convince Dev to keep the the base on Malin Head open and upgrade that?
There was a radar in the Western Isles at RAF Aird Uig. Now closed in the 2010 cuts!
Yes and no. It’s use as a radar site ended much earlier, when ops moved to Buchan.
It was a comms site when it closed in 2010.
All the other RRH in Scotland remain, and Saxa Cord has been reactivated.
QinetiQ also have radar facilities in the Hebrides.
But our Typhoons intercepte them every single time. No matter what direction they come from.
Not entirely correct. The majority of flights the Russians do either come out of the Baltic and over Denmark or they follow the Norwegian coast. Also Iceland has four long range radar sites situated around the Country. These do pick up a lot of Russian aircraft. There is also a radar site in Canada that covers the southern half of Greenland. However, there are a few gaps that Russian aircraft exploit.
They easily detect the Russian rust . They would never get past we’ve seen how bad they are in Ukraine pathetic .
We have the RRH at Portreath, which I assumed covers the SW approaches, and the RRH at Benbecula, again assume looking N West. West, as you say, is the problem.
Sounds promising.
“Israel’s Rafael Advanced Defense Systems announced on 14 June that it is developing a new air-defence missile called the Sky Sonic to intercept hypersonic threats.
In a statement released ahead of the missile’s official unveiling at the Paris Air Show on 19 June, the company claimed the new interceptor offers “exceptional manoeuvrability and high-speed capabilities” enabling it to counter hypersonic missiles travelling at Mach 10 with “unmatched precision and stealth”.”
LINK
Jeez, the Israelis are going gang busters with their tech these. Aster-Mach 10 anyone? C’mon MBDA, get crackin’! Lol. 😆
Lol👍Engine upgrades on the way!
LINK
It’s certainly difficult to ascertain what air defences can take out Kinzhal as yet, but as Patriot has done so it seems others will be able to as well, even T-45 before it’s upgrades may be able to if in the right place. A lot of questions on the missile but fact is it’s an upgrade of a Soviet design that flies about 1000 mph faster from what’s known. It certainly is not a much hyped hypersonic missile of the type being ‘sold’ rightfully as game changing. Because of its inherent limitations that would otherwise defy the laws of physics,… Read more »
“The escorts would be Mig-31/Su-35 long range fighters.”
No, they would be used as scrap metal.
The image from Eurofighter World showing the Typhoon armed with 14 Meteor and two IRIS-T air-to-air missiles. (Photo: Eurofighter)
https://theaviationist.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Typhoon_Air-to-Air_Beast_Mode_1-678×381.jpg
Wow, can wipe out the Orcs “strategic bomber” force with one plane 😀
He’s another Russian troll, but yes, more Typhoons over the next seven years (30/40) would be a very useful addition.
The inclusion of Radar 2 and some Naval Strike (JSM) capability, would make the Orcs think twice for sure!
More F35’s would make them think twice. 😉
‘A’ models?
B model has the same air 2 air capability. All aspect stealth, APG-81 radar, un matched situational awareness, great performance. IRST, Digital Helmet Mounted Display, Electronic warfare suite.Truly networked. Deadly. 👍
Range? And in the absence of Buccaneer the F-35A with ASMP would be nice. 🙂
F35B carrys considerably more fuel than a Typhoon. Pilots always want more fuel, but the F35 range myth are blown out of all proportion. SPEAR3 will a very capable strike/anti ship capability. 8 missiles will be able to be carried internally.
I know. Times move on and so must I.
The Buccaneer was a fantastic aircraft. Better than the Tornado in the anti ship role in it’s day in many ways.
When?
Lets stick to some facts about the F35B on the carriers. Start with maintenance. A widely quoted figure is 50 hours maintenance per hour of sortie time. 100 hours for a two hour combat mission. With say, 15 F35Bs on a carrier, that equates to a large specialist engineering team below decks working 24/7 on 8-hour watches in a possible high intensity warfare scenario Within 36 hours aircraft availability will start to be restricted, reducing the military options available to mission planners. And worse, the enemy will note the reduced sortie rate. This aircraft type has known engineering and software… Read more »
Right David. All fast jets are high maintenance. When the jets are embarked on a carrier, the whole sqn engineering team also embarks, plus the ships own air engineering department. Once at sea the engineers drop straight into a 8 hours on/off routine. So do the Merlin engineers, so do the Wildcat or whatever other aircraft types maybe onboard. This is the normal working pattern to support aircraft carrier engineering operations since we first ever put aircraft to sea. The Harrier was a pain to maintain at sea the Super Hornet is maintenance heavy, and the F14 Tomcat was an… Read more »
Thanks for your – as ever – detailed reply. I have to say I do admire the F35B, especially as about 15% of all of them sold are built here
This is a nice clip from yesterday showing a couple of them doing a short takeoff at RAF Marham
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_upD_4Pcuk
Enjoy!
Ah, Ted Coningsby. That’s a great channel. Lovely bloke who runs it. He’s also a wedding photographer 😃👍
To be fair it would take whoever was on the receiving end of an attack by an F35 50 hours to determine who/what hit them, they will have a hard time tracking one on radar, and when you can have 8 spear 3 missiles carried internally that can hit targets with incredible presicion with little chance of being detected, it wouldn’t take long to get the job done plus with the added bonus that for every mile the F35 goes deeper into enemy territory it would be collecting vital data on enemy positions.
Loved the Buccaneer.
F-35-B Range: 1,667 km
Top Speed: 1,976
Typhoon Range: 2,900Km
Top Speed: 2,495 km/h
Duely noted. Didn’t the Israelis develop a stealth drop tank for their F-35Bs?
F-35: 2x 600 Gallon Drop tanks
Typhoon: 2×2,000 litre wing drop tanks, 1×1,000 litre centre line drop tank or 3×1,000 litre drop tanks.
1000 liters=219.969 Imperial Gallons
NEWS FROM THE FLIGHT DECK
“Does your car do the advertised MPG? Aircraft endurance and range very much depends on the flight profiles used. It very rarely matches figures quoted on Wikipedia.”
So the same principal applies to both in that case 😂😅
Thx. Admire a man who is on top of the detail. 🙂
Does your car do the advertised MPG? Aircraft endurance and range very much depends on the flight profiles used. It very rarely matches figures quoted on Wikipedia.
A fighter jet capable of 200 mph with the right radar and weapons Ilke fire and forget can be deadly . The US army on exercise using Apache helicopters have downed 4 th generation jets.
NEWS FROM THE FLIGHTDECK
What is the problem with the F-35 in 2023?
A three-month pause in engine deliveries and delays with the Tech Refresh 3 update now looking at some point in 2024, Block 4 currently delayed until 2029 and no sign of Meteor until then.
And that’s just for starters!
🥱 Usual botchat reply. Better show Poland or the Czech Republic and Romanian your posts, they are the next F35 customers. Or maybe, just maybe, the subject matter experts in these countries know much more about this aircraft and its capabilities then you. Time to get over your 10 year old child like hatred of the F35. Its going to be around for decades to come, in very large number around the globe.
Now that’s more like it! Hope the RAF has this in their “beast mode” can do catalogue!?
Most probably!
That is great image. The radar cross section will be massive with that payload. Also the range will be tiny. The airframe will not carry enough fuel to endure the launch of all those weapons. But great for defending your own airfield.
Does not matter how big your RCS is when you massively out range the enemy and can see them long before they see you. Unless it’s taking on an F22 a Typhoon with meteor will devastate any opponent but especially 40 year old Russia shit like Mig 31 or Su35
They would make a very useful addition to the war in Ukraine. Armament: One M61A1/A2 Vulcan 20mm cannon; AIM 9 Sidewinder, AIM 7 Sparrow, AIM-120 AMRAAM, Harpoon, Harm, SLAM, SLAM-ER, Maverick missiles; Joint Stand-Off Weapon (JSOW); Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM); various general purpose bombs, mines and rockets. “RAVN Aerospace, a Houston-based aerospace company has paid a deposit on 41 Hornets after the RAAF retired them, and is willing to ‘on-sell’ the fighters to Ukraine. RAVN cannot do so however, without the approval of the US government, as the fighters contain American intellectual property, designed by US-based companies McDonnell Douglas… Read more »
Gotta love your confidence in antique bombers and their radar cross section, but then I guess you have little choice in the circumstances. Perhaps we should get a few Shackleton out of the museums to make them feel at home with a few Lightnings to escort them. A beautiful sight but sadly no more effective than what they would face.
Well that’s what Voyager is for..the RAF managed to support typhoon air ops from the UK to Libya so I think they can manage the North Sea and Baltic.
Yaaaaawn…..
Thankyou Nigel for that picture…we may all be grown adults, but who does not like a great picture of a typhoon.😀
Indeed!
Su35 and Mig 31 would be decimated by typhoon with meteor, clearly Ukraine experience shows that the Uk can easily out mass and out shoot the Russian Air Force anywhere from the Norwegian Sea and that’s without NATO intervening.
Quite – if Russia started a conventional pile on the Nordics would be involved before you could blink.
Yes which is strongly enough why we run the JEF, I think British governments figured out in the 16th century is the best way to defend the UK is from thousands of miles away not on the beaches.
The only way they might get away with it would be a Pearl Harbor effort, by making out they are doing their normal probing job and then fire off the odd missile but not sure what that would achieve unless it’s a nuclear strike and tbh there are more logical ways of committing suicide than that as it would do nothing to stop a reprisal strike.
Yes agreed carrying out a surprise attack on the UK and presumably USAF bases in the UK would be a great way to suicide without taking out any of the other guys nuclear weapons. Realistically if your going to do that you would want to force virtually everything you had at four NATO SSBN bases and the USAF minuteman silos. Knocking out the RAF on the ground in the UK would achieve nothing.
A single Patriot launcher was hit by debris thrown up when the remains of an intercepted Kinzhal hit the ground nearby. It did little more than scratch the paint and put a few dents in the panelling. Bear in mind that that was only one of the eight launchers for the battery.
“Kinzhal put a Patriot out of action in Ukraine.”
When did this happen?
It happened on Russian state media but even they had to retract it when the Patriot batteries kept shooting down Russian weapons.
hahaha. It’s incredible what vatniks will believe. They saw a couple flashes on the ground in the general direction of where the Patriots were firing from and instantly thought…”Patriot destroyed”. I think mentality that perfectly explains the state of the Russian military.
It didn’t. An intercepted and shot down Kinzhal wonder weapon fragments caused minor damage to a single Patriot launcher.
What is more important then the Kinzhal damaging patriot is that Patriot a 20+ year old SAM, albeit updated was able to shot down a Kinzhal in flight. Assume it was travelling hypersonic.
That’s the trouble with Hypersonics, the slightest impact or glancing blow and the weapon is lost. It’s own speed counts against it.
It didn’t but the Russian public and indeed it’s cannon fodder soldiers need to think it has, so that like the destruction of far more weapons than Ukraine actually possesses it needs to be reported as destroyed every day to raise moral really is very 1984, Orwell would be making a fortune out of all this if he were alive just think of the inspiration for new works.
NATO most likely knows every time one of these things move on a runway, the units that operate them and probably down to the names of the aircrews. Nothing is impossible but I don’t see your scenario as realistic.
Neither does he but he is toeing the line anyway.
Mig31/SU25 have a combat range of circa 900miles. Not enough if flying from northern Russia. They would need tanker support. Shoot the tanker down and the fighter jocks are swimming home.
Believe that was a hit on the radar by a drone not Kinzhal. All the Kinzhals were shot down.
But it didn’t actually, it was never off line and only minor damage to one of the many individual physical parts which was reportedly repaired within a day or so. Not seen any believable reports of any serious damage as yet, there are only two systems in place so far, certainly at the time of those claims, and the US notified further supply of missiles to these only last week. So that seems strange if it’s out of action.
Russia can’t gain air superiority over Ukraine, let alone hit anything in the UK. Norway also holds QRA with F35’s. Sweden also holds QRA, Finland too. Denmark ect. That’s a lot of friendly airspace for Russian aircraft to get through before our Typhoons are ununleashed.
The famous Putin wonder weapon Kinzahal what Ukraine easily take out . It’s real name is kinder .
Exactly, no medium long range GBAD at all! Time to wake up someone!! CAMM – EX, what happening with this? Thales UK was looking at Iron Dome, what’s happening there? A few AAW T31 picket ships, can then also be used in CSG, LRG or, two more T45 B2, or an extra batch of Typhoon T4s and a 2-3 more E7s? All been mentioned before by us all here. Germany has just ordered Arrow 3 off Israel, Poland has our CAMM, others have NASAM, Patriot, David’s Sling, Mica, Iris or Aster. The UK could easily opt for some of these… Read more »
Sanctions biting in St Petersburg komrade?
Nonsense. Kinzhals have a range of circa 930miles. For any Russian aircraft to get within effective launch distance of the UK, would either involve flying directly over NATO airspace/countries and hence likely to get intercepted/shot down.
If routing from northern Russia, they would still have to fly close to Norway. To get to a launch point to hit targets in the south of the UK would mean the carrying bombers would have to approach quite close to the north of the UK. All within range of Typhoons and Voyager tanker support. It will be a long swim home
Do we know for sure it has that range, in the year prior to the war Putin suddenly decide in his proclamations its range had increased from 6xx to over 900. Geez our MofD can do that with a pen too. I guess the bods will have a far better idea now they have been used though I am not sure if hits in the east (Russia claimed at least one early on where they destroyed a NATO based 50 metres underground – yes I know) have actually been confirmed and thus where they may have been launched from.
Do you mean them Kinzhel what are getting taken out easy .
They don’t have to. They just need to get in range to launch their standoff weapons which for most modern cruise missile is far out of the range of any ground based radars.
There are radars in Northern Norway, that would detect cruise missile launches or their carriers.
In summary then reading all the posts, the UK is untouchable from any form of aerial or naval attack from Russia. Makes you wonder, what is the point ot Tempest? You could argue, Israel is under an even greater threat. Yet is completely confident in the F35A for the next 30 years.
I would have thought that the war in Ukraine would have disabused even the most diehard Russian enthusiast of their sense of awe at the Stone Age Russian airforce and decaying nuclear forces.
They still have their troll farms and bot armies pretending they are a military force 😀
UK has zero defence against Tu-22M3M or Mig-31K armed with Kh-47M2 Kinzhal. UK airbases would be overwhelmed if Russia launched an aerial attack. UK has no hypersonic missile capability, no credible air defence systems like Patriot or David’s Sling. No credible carrier capability (unless backed up by the USMC). Also the UK does not practice dispersal of it’s fighters like Sweden and Finland. Take out Brize, there would be no AAR and no air defence over the North Sea. Hypothetical situation, Russian launched an aerial attack coming from the high north on the UK using a combination of it’s bomber… Read more »
Have to hope the T45’s are all in the country then!
T45 would provide the dome around the UK. But T45 could not stop the Kh-47. The point is without NATO the UK is powerless. For example in the Falklands, the UK lost warships. If RN had a credible carrier force, that would of not happened. The UK armed forces worst enemy is not Putin, it is No10.
How sad that a delusional person such as yourself would think we care what the Russian command think, they are all old vodka soaks who couldn’t run a bath let alone a coordinated attack on NATO.
A30 with SAMPSON us a better system than PATRIOT.
So a T45 can take those out.
Agree. I think a type 45 could easily intercept Kinzhal missiles. Unlike the Russians bragging about their wonder weapons the UK doesn’t brag, we don’t need too. Our weapons actually work.
NLAW Frost old bean?
That’s just one weapon that turned a load of child abducting, looting, rapists into the Russian army’s low flying turret ejection display team.
I’d have loved it last year if HMS Dauntless had taken out those 17 foolish Russian jets that tried to buzz her. You’ve no idea what a type 45 is capable of.
The problem with the T45’s is that only two of them have had the PIP and the other four are alongside. This means little training for their crews and none using massed target drones. The fact is that without medium range UKAD around our military bases we are indeed reliant on other NATO countries to interdict a massed Russian bomber attack using their long range cruise missiles. This is a topic that has been discussed here many times. I have yet to see any response from the defence establishment other than they don’t think it’s likely, so we don’t need… Read more »
SB has every idea what a T45 is capable of.
You also overlook the fact that air-to-air missiles are perfectly capable of intercepting missiles as well as aircraft
Let’s hope this mythical Kh-47 hasn’t had its warhead stolen! Hate to see you in tears of disappointment!
“But T45 could not stop the Kh-47.”
False! Aster 30 is more recent than
Patriot!
Is that you again harald, back with you bull!
The U.K had the right kind of carriers for the prevailing conditions there
at the time of the Falklands War.
Yes, they could of been bigger!
The RN was moved on a lot in warpony since the Falklands!
You gone to lick Putler’s boots again?
are you bonkers of course the UK lost warships in the Falklands..the RN travelled 9000 miles from its home base camped out under the air umbrella of a not insignificant regional power, then proceeded to undertake a successful amphibious assault on an island with prepared defences….while defending against and destroying said regional powers airforce and forcing its navy into port….literally the only other nation on that planet that could have done that was the US. The point is it’s very unlikely the Russian airforce is going to able able to get its bombers with the required range to launch a… Read more »
Hello comrade, how’s the bot farm today? Seems like your not to up on defence issues so allow me to explain. Is this a hypothetical sneak attack? Clearly UK intelligence knows what Putin is having for breakfast at the moment so I can’t see the donkeys putting together such a large strike package with no knowledge by the UK. Typhoon with meteor travelling with Voyager tankers can take anything out this side of the Arctic. The UK does have Hypersonic weapons able to reach any part of Russian territory at the moment it’s also has the full suite or carrier… Read more »
Well said Jim.
The RAF dusted off dispersal plans and drills in 2021. You may not see it in action but the plans are there.
Our lack of ground based defence is appalling though. Cruise missiles are a big threat if there’s no last ditch protection. Its reckless to base the whole plan on taking out the source before launch.
Delete UK insert just about every other country in NATO! What if what if, hence why we are in NATO, but I forget you don’t like NATO do you! But the Russians don’t just appear, it’s not a war film where you get your knowledge pal, they don’t just take off and appear! But I’m sure you know best….
Well so far the “Mighty” Russian airforce has failed to overwhelm Ukraine’s armed forces, however, they have proved very good at using expensive missiles to demolish civilian houses.
You’re delusional or a troll, which is it?
Neither, I just like to wind you all up for fun. But please remind yourself, NATO have done nothing, zilch, to prevent the war in Ukraine. Russia acts like NATO is not there. A glut of old F-16s will do nothing. Russia are gaining territory. They have secured the land bridge to the Crimea, and now they control Belarus. Western interest in Ukraine will fade. Ukraine will become smaller. Russia are waiting for the inevitable cracks in NATO.
Thanks for confirming your delusions
Hilarious. NATO has done nothing but donate small quantities of hardware to Ukraine which has meant Ukraine both stopping the invasion dead on its boots north of Kyiv and turning the tide of battle at Kherson and causing huge loses at Bakhmut.
Let’s see how Ukraine’s counter offensive goes shall we? We will revisit your delusional state in a few weeks Frostki old bean.
Ps give my regards to Johnski MK when your handlers let you talk to each other.
That’s strange its whole argument for the Imperial project was supposedly because it was there so thank you for confirming that particular lie. Let’s see however if it behaves as if NATO isn’t there whether it invades the Baltic States or Poland. It will imitate a Tiger but in reality only a paper one. Russia is dying and this is but the final vicious flailing to defy the odds. Its only future as even a superficial thriving entity is to become a colony of China, that’s a very sad consequence of this delusion of Imperial grandeur.
Oh dear knowledge and facts are two things you seem to be missing! Never mind eh, your posts don’t wind us up, we find them amusing, sad but amusing.
If Russian junkyards don’t run out of equipment we will have to call up Marvels Avenger’s!
Nonsense, we have the magic that is the cup of tea, as everything turns out alright after a cuppa.
Seriously though, if an older Block 2 Patriot has shown that it can intercept Kinzhal, then the Sea Viper system definitely can. I also believe that both Meteor and ASRAAM would stand a pretty good chance of intercepting Kinzhal.
A force to do that would be spotted as it took off and be substantially eliminated, as we have seen fast fundamentally Soviet era updated missiles (they are NOT true hypersonic missiles it’s predecessor was almost hypersonic but useless) can be taken out by decent air defence such as possessed by T-45 so it would be akin to a suicide mission as response would be lethal. Cruise missiles from subs would be far more concerning but likely would mean the loss of many subs too in that environment, for what real gain?
As a contrast the R.A.F has an overstretched and ridiculous fleet of only 140 fighters, thanks políticians.
But 140 viable useful fighters that can outmatch all the Russian junk?
The Russians have a lot of planes in poor condition, correct, but the problem is that there are 1,500 fighters, of them about 350 SU 35/34/30 which are pretty decent, 140 fighters in the RAF is a ridiculous number no matter how good the fighters are. , it’s like the R.N. that in the 80s they had 60 escorts and now 18, yes, they are better ships but they cannot be divided.
I’d love to see RAF have T4 tranche of Typhoon etc.
UK spends a lot on defence: it is all a matter of choices.
Unfortunately with the crisis enveloping NHS, in spite of massive spending increases, it is going to be very tough to get significantly more budget to defence.
That said I do think a more ‘front line first’ strategy is taking place with up arming assets depending stockpile’s. The ridiculous thing is that a lot is doesn’t cost very much at all – in the great scheme of things. The smell of coffee has percolated that far.
The tranche 2 and 3 airframes will be upgraded to T4 standard with the new AESA radar.
Numbers are not great but it’s pretty much the most capable plane on the planet in its class and the only plane in production that can beat it just happens to be ours as well.
Perhaps you should do the math! If we have 30 F35 and they do 4th gen 20/1 and Typhoons do Russian jets 10/1 I believe that the Russians will need more aircraft! An extra 1,000 or so to stand a chance!
140 typhoons or F35Bs is a small number, I wish HMG would get their arses in gear and do a crash rearmament programme. But if a typhoon can take out 6-10 of Russia’s highest performing jets each using meteor, asraam, amraam then pretty soon all of Russia’s capable air force is gone.
Unfortunately we dont have 140 Typhoons. On any one day only about 50 front lineTyphoon airframes are available – with pilot training another issue. Even if we had more there are insufficient air-to-air refueling tankers to keep them up to deal with any large scale Russian air assault, particulary condidering that the Voyagers would need protection too The defence estabishment and the politicians need to wake up to this threat and stop giving us the usual platitudes. The recent £18 billion settlement, though appreciated, was to pay for ARKUS and to cover previous MoD cock-ups. We need to stop the… Read more »
If we needed 140 in a real emergency 140 would be available plus F35 also T1/ T2 light fighters armed with sidewinder would suddenly become available you will be surprised how fast and what’s available in real emergency.
It’s ok saying only X number are available on any given day.Its the same situation for our enemies too. Every fighter fleet on the planet has x number in maintenance. Long term or short term maintenance. Upgrade projects ect. No Air Force has a full fleet just sat around waiting to go to war at 10mins notice. Managing fighter fleets is a complex business.
So if those Russia fighters are so star spangled awesome, and in such large numbers, how come they can’t achieve air superiority over Ukraine? 40 Typhoons with 20 F35B’s would cause Havoc for Russian forces. On the ground, and in the air.
A significant number of those are tranche 1 and will be going away shortly most of which are not in service as we speak.
You don’t speak you whine, my little troll US failed fanboy!
AJAX Inquiry has reported today, not read it in detail but gist is people too polite to complain and when they did their commanding officers just thought they were whinging, doesnt blame any individuals for failure but a collective culture. Alongside the release of the report the government announced regular training had now begun with Ajax.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1162944/Report_of_the_Armoured_Cavalry_Programme_Lessons_Learned_Review.pdf
Lessons learned 😂
Don’t give unqualified army officers input in multi billion dollar defence contracts and don’t rely on US defence contractors to do anything but screw you.
You could say the same of any contracting environment!
Yes but in most places you would get fired or taken out behind the chemical toilets and shot for wasting billions on never ending failed programs.
Can you imagine making a mistake that cost your employer over £1 billion? What’s the chances you would not be atleast charged with fraud if you did.
It would seem to me that the ‘spotting’ and tracking of aircraft such as these, may not be a particular problem. I say may not, as if I were in a position to do so, I would use swarms of drones as decoys, massing and moving and generally nausing up radar tracking… Anyhow, I think a Nuclear strike could succeed against the UK, and that’s the point really. Only 1 bomber would need to get through for it to be regarded as a successful operation, especially against an enemy who is happy to engage in a war of attrition. The… Read more »
“ especially against an enemy who is happy to engage in a war of attrition.”
Comrade Mad Vlad didn’t look so happy with his war of attrition?
True, however that seems to be the SOP of the Red Vlad barmy army.
That’s the point any logic if warped of these scenarios are a nuclear strike, that can be achieved far more easily tbh but in reality you can prevent a nuclear strike at best somewhat limit it a little, so if you trigger a nuclear response then what is the success of this strike? Some might say Russia unlike Britain is a massive target but truth is most of its cities and high value targets and the core of power exists in the much smaller European part of the Country and the loss of half a dozen cities would effectively destroy… Read more »
Essentially the best way to prevent a nuclear attack on the UK is the deterrent. Is if Russia thinks it’s going to be gutted by the UK nuclear deterrent. it would gut Russia and remove it as a modern nation, even before the inevitable end of the world conflagration that ended humanity ( once one SSBN attacks it will trigger a catastrophic conflagration..russian will be forces to attack the whole of NATO with its strategic nuclear arsenal and the rest of NATO would do the same to russia…the two European Nuclear deterrents are as much triggers as anything).
We need to establish a network of Aegis ashore with SM6 or something, can’t belive how open we are!
SM6 is hideously expensive.
It us much more likely to be the ASTER family if weapons that is used.
Maybe starting with A30 and upgrading to NT when it arrives.
Thanks
I would agree, we are suppose to be collaborating on a European missile shield with Germany and 12 others though.
Missile defence will always be better done on a continent wide basis but I would like to see us with a SAMP/T style system using Aster 30 NT as a theatre level air defence and BMD capability able to deploy in the UK for atmospheric interception of war heads missed by the NATO or european missile shields.
The only bit that is not is the sub launches cruise missile threat, this needs managed very locally as you need sea and land based system close to the target or path of the cruise missile..it’s why we really need the land based components of a UK integrated air defence system to be able to defend key infrastructure.
It’s sad to think we have had 50% of the system sat on a hill overlooking Portsmouth, for the best part of 15 years. It has everything barring the missiles and the data-links. So let’s call it Sea Viper ashore. As it has better radar than SAMP/T, because it has both a fully working Sampson and S1850M. How much would it take and cost to make it a fully working Sea Viper system?
I have always wondered why not do that as it’s in the most perfect place to defend some very key infrastructure.
Yes, it is very frustrating. Higher up, and several installations covered locally.
…shocking that it is not even actually connected to something that goes whizz-bang covering the main Portsmouth base.
Without getting too carried away Russia is a spent force. To acheive anything it has to take on the whole of NATO. The JEF countries alone could take out these bombers, whether or not they have cruise missile armament.
As long as we can take out their air to air refuelling capability! Their long rang bombers aren’t going very far.
In reality the Russian bomber fleet twould be 2 minutes work for a few F35 and typhoon .
in truth the UK does need to invest in making sure it can provide ground or sea based air defence for key infrastructure, but not because of the Russian bomber force, which can be intercepted at distance and destroy by NATO airforces, but because the Russian SSN and SSGN fleet have been refitted to effectively attack NATO bases at long range with Cruise missiles and airborne air defences are not the best at detecting and intercepting cruise missiles, for the cruise missile threat you need seaborne and land based air defences.
The Tu-160 White Swan or Blackjack to our NATO friends, a supreme warplane capable of sustained supersonic speeds, with an intercontinental range. Armed with long range cruise missiles with nuclear warheads, it provides the 3rd element in Russias nuclear posture, yet it poses no threat to the UK. The RAF would see them coming and destroy them before they can deploy their Kh55 weapons. The RAF on the other hand, used to have a strategic bomber force, last used in the Libya intervention, Tornados flew from the UK with 2 Storm Shadows and returned non stop. The other 200 cruise… Read more »
If you think the tornado was a strategic bomber…. Well That’s your take on that.
I don’t, but the raf did so.
Pants and socks need doing, hurry up and get them dried!
Hi George, could you ever get Mr Heappey & Mr Ellwood to do a guest article for UKDJ? You could imagine the response from all of us here! All our advice would be free too! 😂
I still think the UK should come up with something – (affordable, rough and ready, and only using the appropriate level of tech for the job) – like to have some sort of long-range-long-endurance cheap ex-airliner, fitted out with a shed load of missiles and all data linked to a F35 or whatever. This could then counter any air threat approaching our skies at distance. Also, as the RAF lacks any “heavy hitting” stand-off weapon or delivery platform for this, why not use said “airliner” and strap a WWII-era “Grand Slam” big bomb on it, equipped with a rocket pack… Read more »
Big problem for Russia after the war eventually ends Russian not so wonderful wonder weapons will be very difficult to sell even to 3 rd world countries. Might see a few wonder weapons on eBay.
I imagine China is going to eat all of their market in such countries.
Again Chinese weapons are totally untested and probably the same quality of rubbish Russia produce imo could possibly be worse ? China can’t yet make a decent screw or drill for B&Q never mind high tec weapons that would survive a real test .
But they will be cheap and no strings attached compared to the West. And given Russia has burned though its stocks, it’s not going to be competing.
Correct .
What prompted James Heappey to brief the Defence Select Committeee about Russia’s bomber force? Has something changed recently?
Both Putin’s russian regime and the chinese CCP PLA. Both have a need for an upgraded heavy stealth bomber. Capable of deploying multiple hypersonic missiles from an internal weapons bay. It seems to be the perfect candidate for a joint project.