In a series of alarming attacks, several commercial vessels, including two UK-owned ships, were attacked in the southern Red Sea, triggering a response from the USS Carney, an Arleigh-Burke Class destroyer of the United States Navy.
These attacks, occurring in international waters, have heightened tensions in the region and underscored the growing risks to international shipping lanes.
The first incident unfolded at approximately 9:15 a.m. Sanaa time when the USS Carney, patrolling the Red Sea, detected an anti-ship ballistic missile launched from Houthi-controlled areas in Yemen. The missile targeted the MV Unity Explorer, a Bahamas-flagged, UK-owned bulk carrier. The missile impacted near the vessel, which was manned by crews from two nations. Fortunately, there were no casualties.
At noon, the situation escalated when the USS Carney engaged and successfully shot down an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) launched from Houthi-controlled regions. The drone’s specific target was unclear, but its trajectory suggested a potential threat to the Carney. This engagement occurred without any damage to the US vessel or injuries to its crew.
A second attack on the MV Unity Explorer occurred at approximately 12:35 p.m., this time resulting in a direct missile hit. In response, the Carney provided assistance and during the operation, detected and destroyed another inbound UAV. The Unity Explorer reported minor damage from this strike, but again, no crew members were harmed.
Later in the afternoon, around 3:30 p.m., another UK-associated vessel, the MV Number 9, a Panamanian flagged, Bermuda and UK-owned bulk carrier, was struck by a missile. This incident also resulted in no casualties.
The fourth and final attack of the day occurred at 4:30 p.m. when the Panama-flagged MV Sophie II was hit by a missile. In response to the distress call, the USS Carney intercepted and shot down another UAV en route to assist the Sophie II, which reported no significant damage.
U.S. Central Command has condemned these attacks; here ‘s their full statement.
“Today, there were four attacks against three separate commercial vessels operating in international waters in the southern Red Sea. These three vessels are connected to 14 separate nations.
The Arleigh-Burke Class destroyer USS CARNEY responded to the distress calls from the ships and provided assistance. At approximately 9:15 a.m. Sanaa time, the CARNEY detected an anti-ship ballistic missile attack fired from Houthi controlled areas of Yemen toward the M/V UNITY EXPLORER, impacting in the vicinity of the vessel. UNITY EXPLORER is a Bahamas flagged, U.K. owned and operated, bulk cargo ship crewed by sailors from two nations.
The CARNEY was conducting a patrol in the Red Sea and detected the attack on the UNITY EXPLORER. At approximately 12 p.m., and while in international waters, CARNEY engaged and shot down a UAV launched from Houthi controlled areas in Yemen. The drone was headed toward CARNEY although its specific target is not clear. We cannot assess at this time whether the Carney was a target of the UAVs. There was no damage to the U.S. vessel or injuries to personnel. In a separate attack at approximately 12:35 p.m., UNITY EXPLORER reported they were struck by a missile fired from Houthi controlled areas in Yemen.
CARNEY responded to the distress call. While assisting with the damage assessment, CARNEY detected another inbound UAV, destroying the drone with no damage or injuries on the CARNEY or UNITY EXPLORER.
UNITY EXPLORER reports minor damage from the missile strike. At approximately 3:30 p.m. the M/V NUMBER 9 was struck by a missile fired from Houthi controlled areas in Yemen while operating international shipping lanes in the Red Sea. The Panamanian flagged, Bermuda and U.K. owned and operated, bulk carrier reported damage and no casualties. At approximately 4:30 p.m., the M/V SOPHIE II, sent a distress call stating they were struck by a missile. CARNEY again responded to the distress call and reported no significant damage. While en route to render support, CARNEY shot down a UAV headed in its direction.
SOPHIE II is a Panamanian flagged bulk carrier, crewed by sailors from eight countries. These attacks represent a direct threat to international commerce and maritime security. They have jeopardized the lives of international crews representing multiple countries around the world. We also have every reason to believe that these attacks, while launched by the Houthis in Yemen, are fully enabled by Iran. The United States will consider all appropriate responses in full coordination with its international allies and partners.”
With Iran now churning out Shehad 136 drones with a turbine engine and a seeker this is going to become a real problem. They have now shown the same drone launched from pickup truck which means logically these could be launched from a fast boat as well.
A step up from boat swarm attacks, a drone swarm attack is a bit more ominous. LOwer level drones (let’s say, those travelling slowly) need to countered with an affordable response and Perhaps the mix of camm/martlet/40&57mm Bofors is the way to go and the type31 could be the ultimate drone buster?
Who you gonna call…
AA (sorry)
Kinda depends on the payload. Great headlines but no real detail on whether the drones were a actual risk to the ships beyond starting small fires. I’m not saying the risk isn’t there but details are important, as an off the shelf commercial drone poses no risk but could be shot down by the US to justify military actions in the region, we hsve all grown up in the dodgy dossier area and so need details/.evidence. let’s not go into another war without it
To be fair with Iran openly supporting Russia’s invasion of Ukraine Europe (me anyway) is itching for a god damn reason
They need to be very, very careful with what they are supplying and how they are acting right now
I think if Russia says something along the line of “were going to give Iran nukes” it’ll be full invasion time before that happens
The whole region is a powder keg, going to war with iran would be a serious mistake. Not only would it be another Afgan mess after, but likely it would spill over the whole region. Not to mention they would not be easy to beat as they have a lot of experience in paramilitary combat.
That also assumes they don’t already have nukes or at least dirty bombs that they could use.
Paramilitary combat, don’t make me laugh. Any NATO armed force would make mincemeat of them.
You mean like they did in afgan, a war they lost. Nato would make mincemeat of any army in a conventional warfare situation, but non conventional and political limitations and fear of collateral dmg hits in. Look at Israel, their approach of mass murder would not be permitted by the Western public.
Exactly. However at the end of the day I suppose you have to shoot them down, big or small, just in case.
Whereas a small drone is unlikely to do any meaningful damage, the propaganda value of such a hit would be way above the actual effect, or in a worse case scenario the drone actually manages to strike something important on the ship. OR cause casualties.
Given the costs of modern AA missiles, i like the idea of a layered defence using 57 and 40mm guns (or 76/57mm) as the reach and more importantly, sustainability is there for multiple engagements.
AA
I’m just concerned that the US and therefore in turn the UK is headed for war with Iran. At every opportunity the US government blames everything on Iran. I’ve no idea how accurate it is but I fear they are building justification for another war, which after iraq/afgan won’t be easily done as the public don’t want another war. There is however a lot of money to be made by them and I’m sure the firms involved will be putting pressure on starting another.
So Iran don’t attacks US forces in Iraq, Syria, elsewhere…?
Houthi theme is not ?
Should it be suggested that Russia will gift Iran nukes, it will be a nato whitewash
Give us a reason, any valid reason to cut the land corridor where Iran meets Armenia and Azerbaijan, and and to send more military into the ocean so they can’t touch our shipping lanes.
We wouldn’t even have to attack any of their major cities, and they wouldn’t dare go on any offensive.
Russia would be scared shitless and forced to move troops to their southern border which stretches miles.
The thing is, we can’t do something so tactical as this without a valid reason.
What I’m saying is, they need to give us one.
Iran is supplying weaponry to Russia which is being used to take Ukraine. Sure to this, they are in my eyes, our absolute obvious enemy which NATO needs to put down fast.
Would china join? Maybe. But that just brings into the light the snake is the room who has been fanning the flames of war for some time.
We can’t go to war with Iran, it would be a blood bath. Thousands of nato troops would die and thousands civilans more in the terrorist attacks it would trigger. Best option with Iran is to open up to them and make them reliant on the west for trade and luxury goods. Make is their friend and not enemy.
Don’t get my wrong I’m sure nato would easily win, but they have had decades to prepare for it and they will make it a very bloody war.
Then there is the what next, taking out iraq/afgan worked out so well for world peace…
Cutting them off would just make them double down in crazy.
At the end of the day a ship of any king is a floating bomb, any object as to be dealt with firstly. A fire on board a ship can be fatal
Really? What you think a 4kg explosive does to a ship radar, to a bridge, or explode inside heli hangar while open, or carrier hangar deck?
At the moment I think Shahed type drones have a limited use as they can only hit static targets with a known location (somewhat inaccurately as well if Ukraine’s experience of them is anything to go by). It’s much harder to develop a drone with some kind of self-guidance system which could intercept a ship. The real threat from them is against fixed infrastructure or military assets which are currently static such as moored ships or aircraft sitting out in the open on a base.
The limitation on cheaper quad-copter type drones is range and vulnerability to jamming. If you watch the videos of FPV drones targetting vehicles etc in Ukraine they often lose the video feed a few seconds before impact and the operator has to kind of guess where their target will be in a few seconds and aim for that point and hope. I imagine shipbourne jammers will be alot more effective given the available power output.
We should be seriously developing directed energy weapons. Lasers and microwave beams can bring down a drone at the cost of a few pence per shot and they are, of course, very accurate. The really hard part is detecting the incoming drones in the first place as they have such a small radar cross section.
The other major threat are unmanned semi-submersibles of the kind Ukraine have used. I wouldn’t mind betting that is where Iran or its proxies in Yemen might be focussing their next efforts.
And Iran have several more drone models than Shahed.
Luckily, we’ll have Shapps and Cameron to the rescue; our longed for Dynamic Duo.
I thought it was spelt Schrapps
Things are certainly getting heated, although I have to wonder why the Houthis are getting involved at all; they have enough to be getting on with fighting the Saudis, and a certain level of global sympathy in that regard considering the way KSA is prosecuting that war. To lose that by slinging some missiles at international merchant vessels seems stupid.
Also, minor point George, but your sentence: “In response to the distress call, the USS Carney intercepted and shot down another UAV en route to assist the Sophie II, which reported no significant damage.” I think there needs to be a ‘while’ in between UAV and en route; otherwise you’re suggesting that the UAV was trying to help and the USS Carney cruelly shot it down. Petty of me, I know, but my eyes just get drawn to that kind of stuff. Please keep up the excellent and broad content!
Houthis are Iran’s puppets they do what they are told, and the safest way for Iran to have a go at Israel /US/UK is to get the Houthis to fire all the shots.
Exactly so. Who is the paymaster……you create a bit if medium level trouble…..we gift you another ship load of……and Mad Vlad is happy so he gift the Mad Mullahs some other useless tech…..
I think a lot of this is to do with who controls the Houthis, i.e. Iran. We know that Russia is purchasing a lot of arms from Iran. Plus Russia is going to be “selling/giving” Iran some brand new Su35s, that were earmarked for Egypt, (that have been sitting in a hanger for nearly two years now!), along with some other toys. So I would hazard to guess Russia has had a quiet word with Iran to stir up as much trouble as possible, using its proxies. Which diverts World and in particular US attention and supplies away from Ukraine. If the Houthis get caught and there is retribution. Well the attacks came from a failed country and has nothing to do with Iran!
There is a bit of mystery though with one of Iran’s proxies, Hezbollah. There was lots of talk of supporting their Hamas brothers following the devastating attacks against Israel on 7th Oct. But when it actually came to action, Hezbollah have only conducted a few border skirmishes and launched a few rockets against Israel. Did Hezbollah have a sudden chill up its spin, when a USN carrier group parked itself in the Eastern Med? As it looks like they are only paying lip service to supporting Hamas.
All this attention though is diverting eyes from and more importantly supplies to Ukraine, to Russia’s benefit. It’s almost like someone had a cunning plan!
Maybe someoe should visit the Iranian factory with a tomahawk or two?
And some for the Kremlin, with genocidal murderer Putin & his cronies inside at the precise strike. 💣💣💣
Totally agree
International law, no?
Maybe Russia should hit some NATO base where the benderite troops are being trained or a production facility?
But of course it’d be article 5 craze all over the town.
In the meanwhile Iran has been being hit with terrorist attacks from Israel and their buds for 20-30 years and it is… 👌
You can bet on that, I don’t believe in such overt coincidences, Russia has become a terrorist state sadly and is encouraging havoc wherever it can.
Exactly, Putin’s strategy is to set as many fires as he can to distract and occupy US and western resources generally. The idea is to weaken the defence of Europe. Poland have said we have about 3 years before Russia attacks Europe.
I had not heard that Polish forecast/prediction. It would account for Poland’s sizable rearming.
Could a weakened Russia really attack Europe in 2026? If they take on a NATO country – it’s WW3 – and the end of Russia!
Morning Graham, I confess I don’t really have the expertise to know what’s going on with Poland. They seem to be engaged in a battle for their culture – church vs woke, and are behaving as though they cannot rely on either the EU or NATO to defend them. Are they panicking? I don’t know. But both the Times and the Telegraph today carry front page articles highlighting the threat from Russia. The republicans in the US senate have just voted down Biden’s latest aid package for Ukraine ( and Israel). Russia seem to be holding the ground they seized in Ukraine and Putin must be hoping for a Trump election victory. The west was too slow and reticent and with Syria and Crimea. I see the military junta in Niger has just ended its security agreement with the EU and signed one with Russia. On balance I would go with Poland’s and Ukraine’s reading of Putin’s intentions. They have personal experience of living under Russian rule. There are lots of ethnic Russians in the Baltic states and access to Kaliningrad would be a big prize for Putin.
Morning Paul, My familiarity with Poland is fleeting – I have visited the country twice but as a tourist of course.
Poland’s economy is doing very well but I think is stalling a little now. As you mention, their history is one of their country having been fought over many times including by the USSR and Nazi Germany in living memory. They are not far from the Russian bear and Putin is irrational to put it mildly.Poland hosts eFP NATO troops (forward deployment) and that BG contingent includes some British soldiers (lt recce sqn, I think).
I had not heard of the church vs woke culture clash. I would be shocked if they doubt NATO would come to their aid if attacked by Russia. Article 5 has been called in the past (after 9/11) and it worked – every single NATO country rallied around and deployed troops (except Iceland which has no army) to Afghanistan to chase down AQ and their Taliban backers. As mentioned NATO has a multi-national eFP BG in Poland, a tangible demonstration of support to Poland’s defence whilst being a deterrent against Russia. There is a strong relationship between UK and Poland and US and Poland, the US supplying much kit to Poland include M1 tanks.
Is Poland panicking or sensibly rearming, as we did in 1935-39.
Very worrying that lame duck Biden can’t get his latest military aid package voted through – if Trump gets in, military aid is likely to stop altogether.
I has not heard about Niger – staggering that they switch from the EU to Russia for security agreement, but not sure that has any effect on the West vs. Russia situation.
General (Ret’d) Shirreff wrote a faction book in 2016 postulating that Putin would invade the Baltic nations assuming that NATO would not respond quickly enough or even at all. Not sure why he set that scenario ahead of Russia invading Ukraine comprehensively. Linkage to the enclave of Kaliningrad would be a prize as you say but I doubt Putin would have the energy or resources to do this. He sees an enlarged stronger NATO and his forces are weakened. He knows that WW3 would be the outcome of an attack against the Baltic states to secure that prize.
Hi Graham, I think Putin’s approach would be to undermine the democracies in the Baltic states by fomenting dissent based on ethnic Russian loyalties. This is the way he turned Crimea.
I think Poland are prudently re-arming and looking at a map I can understand why.
Sadly I don’t think Putin is irrational, I think he knows exactly what he is doing.
The big difference is that Crimea was not a NATO country or part thereof, but the Baltic states are.
If Putin knew exactly what he was doing he would not be in such a mess with his Ukraine war, which was meant to have the whole country conquered within a few short weeks.
Both fair points. Putin did want Kyiv; it does look as though a Russian Crimea and land bridge is the likely outcome of the conflict in the Ukraine in the medium term. Ukraine split into East and West and Putin in power for another 6 or 12 years.
Maybe, but I hope not. I don’t see Putin being in power for as long as 6 to 12 years.
Indeed. Hard to know what’s going on inside closed societies like Russia and China. Bit of Christmas spirit wouldn’t go amiss. You never know…have a good day yourself.
Hezbollah and Hamas have backed different sides in the Syrian civil war ? maybe something to do with it
Quite
And I think it has mostly to do with the definitely-not-a-warcrime Israel operation in Gaza.
What hamas did was ugly and wrong, but understandable, it is their land after all.
What Israel did shows that they’re 2 sets of international law. One for my buds and the other – for the chummers.
You have to be very careful on what you state is a war crime. Legally if you put an arms dump under a hospital, the hospital therefore becomes a legitimate target. As there is no other means of taking out the arms dump, Hamas knew this.
Similarly when people bandy about the Genocide be carried out by Israel. Again this has no legal standing, as genocide is the systematic execution of a populace. If Israel were putting Gaza under siege, then carpet bombing the whole area, without taken precautions to avoid civilian casualties. Then that would be genocide. However, they are not, they have set up safe zones, warned the populace of what area is being targeted and also set times when the area is going to be targeted.
The Gaza strip was originally owned by Egypt. It was swampland that Israel purchased. So if it belongs to anyone it would be Israel. The land was gifted to the PLO during negotiations.
There can be absolutely no sympathising with terrorists! The taking of civilians is not what a normal army does. By taking hostages that can then be battered for prisoners, is not only a form of blackmail, but could also be described as piratism. The population of Gaza are not innocent bystanders in all of this, they voted in Hamas after all.
Hamas knew what Israel’s reaction would be to this depraved and heinous atrocity on the 7th Oct. It has been planning both offensive and defensive actions for years. But if they were building tunnels to move men and materiel around. Why didn’t they build air raid shelters to protect the population? Being cynical, you could say Hamas doesn’t care about its population. However, being a realist, I would say Hamas did it deliberately, as bombed houses and families searching for lost ones makes better PR.
Davey, I think you’ll find your defence against the IOF and IDF simply doesn’t make sense.
1) A lot of media sources are claiming that the supposed arms dump looks sketchy, with mismatching evidence from IDF videos and press videos. The videos I’ve seen alone are laughable and I still cannot get over ‘there is a list’.
2) Those safety zones you speak of, how are civilians ever to know which and when to go to without any internet and key communication infrastructure taken down? And yes they have been indiscriminately attacked under siege, the use of white phosphorus alone shows they have no regard for civilians, but the fact you ignore the use of such weapons means either you’re unaware of how extreme they are, or intentionally try not to bring it up.
3) Also how exactly do you think they got a whole lot of ‘prisoners’ to exchange for some of the hostages. Of course, the media loved to distinguish women and children for hostages and females and teenagers for the ‘prisoners’ the intention of the wording by media doesn’t escape me. There are thousands in detention, many with no formal ruling, that in of itself should count as being held hostage, with no lawful reason to hold them, especially with many being put in solitary.
4) The population most certainly voted them in but that was some 1 and a half decade ago, never mind the fact the median age of the population is below 18, meaning, a large part alive haven’t been able to have their say.
Lastly, I could play the devil’s advocate and ask that supposedly the IDF has in large part been aware at least 1 year that somethings been brewing according to the New York Times, and the Egyptians also claim they sent a warning before, yet the attack still occurred and no formal response force for a couple hours. A lot of Israelis are already asking, if the leaders were given the reports, why did they doubt the attack, especially with a ceasefire from a organisation they dub as not ‘being compliant and chaotic’.
I don’t think Hamas needs to take any intentional PR decisions though I will admit they are making their own. Regardless, the IDF has already demonstrated to be a PR disaster.
This phrase alone shows you know nothing you talking about. It is so ignorant and dumb.
Do you even stop to think what is the difference between a HE round and WP round?
Are you joking? there are a lot of videos os Israeli bombing with secondaries exploding in buildings and tunnels inside city.
I do know though, the smoke of the WP has very harmful effects for any civilians in the area, not to mention the particulates can cause severe burns. It indiscriminately afflicts anyone without proper protection.
That too in areas that would be densely packed.
There are also lots of cases of strikes that are not correct or lawful, such as on refugee camps, jdams used on whole buildings.
My other points still stand.
Israel is technically in the right. But you can only play the victim card so many times. Netanyahu and the Jewish fundamentalists in Israel are sanctioning action that goes way beyond even their own eye for an eye values. Israel will lose friends. They are intent on getting the head of Hamas, cutting off the head of the snake. The problem is that the snake will grow another head.
What was UK fighting the war against Nazies? Was Churchill a fundamentalist?
Is Lord Halifax now the hero of Britain?
Ireland and IRA decades ago gave it a taste about what we can expect from the supposed moral high ground far away brigade.
Halifax and Chamberlain bought us time to rearm. Churchill knew that punishing your adversary fuels resentment: Europe learned that lesson after ww1. The IRA us still working through Sinn Fein to free Ireland. First step is to get a mediator to get the sides to lay fown their arms. The Israelis were caught with their pants down by Hamas. Netanyahu should admit that he screwed up with his policies, resign and ask for help to negotiate the release of all the hostages. But humility is not his strong suit; being an arrogant man he is doubling down on a strategy of violence and repression and large numbers of innocent people are dying. Hamas did wrong. But as my grandmother used to say, two wrongs don’t make a tight. Self restraint is a sign of character. Netanyahu needs to show some.
Aye, indeed. They’re always telling the World to remember, happen be an idea if they reminded themselves what total oppression felt like.
And having said that I fully understand why they are so antsy about protecting themselves from any slieght.
Why act shocked and outraged at Israel’s response to thier version of 9/11? Hamas has been attacking Israel for the last 2 decades using human shields and civillian infrastructure to do this. Of course there going to be high civillian casualties: Hamas planned it to be this way.
Every time Islamists attack Israel, Israel is blamed by default–no Jews? No news!
Hamas has no land, and never has done.
Hamas is a terrorist organisation.
Hamas committed atrocities on a massive scale.
Hamas committed and act of war, after crossing into Israeli land.
Hamas knew exactly how Israel would react. So why did they do it?
All countries have an legal obligation, to protect their citizens.
All countries have a moral obligation to protect their citizens.
All countries have every right, to seek out and destroy those who attack their citizens and their country.
Hamas have/had? Gaza
They could have built a Singapore.
The UN have/had? the Gaza Beach Club and there was a fancy glass building with a Mercedes representative in most posh Hamas district.
You really have a repellent thinking.
Since when it is their land?
Precisely, it showed you can combat without uniform, use schools, hospitals, fire 10000 rockets indiscriminately against cities and nothing happens to you and you bosses in Qatar.
Oh i forgot nothing happens to you that 1000 of those 10000 rockets fall in your own territory.
Seems about right.
So two British owned cargo ships hit. What can we deploy to the region to guard against further attacks?
Having the Type 31 frigates in service now would have been useful. Should have had a credible T21 GP successor/patrol frigate earlier.
HMS Diamond is en- route to the Gulf,it will be a good proving ground for the Sea Viper Missile System.
Aster 30 cost £2m, these 200kg 100mph drones cost $30k. Martlet costs £30k if we can put some teams onboard to fire them.
Yes exactly, these missiles cost well over ￡7.50 each. The RN can’t afford to fire any ordnance.
Maybe cutlasses and belaying pins.
The mere presence of a Type 45 should act as a deterrent and reassure any Merchant Shipping in the area. Obviously you won’t be using multi million pound Asters to shoot down thousand dollar Drones, it is the threat of Ballistic and Cruise Missiles that they will be there for.
Went through the Suez canal couple of weeks ago on the Queen Elizabeth. Captain ordered darken ship on all balconies and open decks.
He explained that her wasnt trying to hide the ship as its position is available on Google,but I assume it was an anti sniper precaution but with whats happened it may have been anti drone caution. We also, reassuringly had 4 Marines on board, anti pirate precaution maybe.
in our convoy was the Dwight D Eisenhower aircraft carrier, now thats what you call reassuring.
The issue is, the combined size of the UK owned and UK flagged fleets are too large for even the USN to protect.
Interesting to note that the British owned ships were all registered offshore in tax havens.
Yes, I’m yet to actually detect any UK involvement anywhere with any of these vessels. Same as last week apparently the Isle of Man is the UK now.
It’s perhaps time to revert to vessels no flying a flag of convenience and actually paying some tax to cover the cost of the navy.
Can we charge for their protection. Rhetorical question as we know the power brokers get all the benefits without having to pay for it more than nominally.
Sure, that’s the way modern shipping works. Most UK flagged ships are not UK owned.
Even UK flagged ships aren’t safe though, as seen by Stena Impero a few years back.
They don’t need escorted from start to end, just sufficient force at chokepoints like the Bab-el-Mandab strait to prevent this. The Houthis aren’t interdicting shipping in the Atlantic or Med are they? Between CTF-150, CTF-151, Operation Atalanta, Op Kipion and whatever independent national or other joint national deployments exist in the region surely 2 doz plus navies can maintain 8-10 warships in a vital shipping lane increasingly under threat?
Sure in one choke point like this it is easier, I was referring to protecting the whole fleet in general, I.e. including Iran, Somalia etc.
Galaxy leader was hijacked in the Red Sea quite far from the strait.
If they were British flagged ships I might be worried. Perhaps Panama can send a vessel to protect them or Bermuda could trying paying a bit of tax.
British flagged ships are mainly foreign owned with foreign crews.
British owned ships are often flagged abroad, but have some British crew.
It is important to protect both.
All ships flagged in Bermuda or IOM are British ships anyway, can be requisitioned by the RN, and are therefore the RNs responsibility to protect.
Good to have friends, particularly as we can’t look after ourselves anymore.
A T45 is deploying to the region. HMS Diamond.
So one un modernised T45 to cover 100,000 sq. miles.
HMS Lancaster just had a crew change in Bahrain, Maybe she’ll be deployed too.
Good. Makes sense given where she is.👍
No longer in BHR. I wont say when she left more than to say a few days ago.
One world-class air defence Destroyer that others Navy’s would have your right arm off to have in service and with that level of capability. Other nations do not have similar equipment in numbers. Even the US Navy is pushed these days. Other nations have just the same issues with battling inflation, retention, recruitment and the cost of modern defence equipment. Other nations do not do it better than us. Its a British disease to put ourselves down.
Unfortunately the Chinese have 50 destroyers, 42 frigates and 70 plus corvettes armed like small frigates. Most of these ships have been built in the last ten to fifteen years.
And how many are operational? a fraction of that number. They have pretty much zero real world conflict experience. The US Navy alone would wipe them out.
Absolutely Robert. No point us worrying about 160 modern warships when we have a T45 on the way.😃
But they don’t have 160 deployable warships, do they. They have a fraction of that number. They have the same issues with manning and refit schedules that we do. They also are not globally deployed. When did we last see a Chinese task group in the Med or English Channel?? When did we last see a capable Chinese destroyer operating independently in the Red Sea of the Gulf?? That would be never. Don’t be blinded by numbers when our enemies can’t come close to matching what we can do. The Chinese also have zero real-world conflict experience. Stop bigging up
up enemies to try and prove a point. Real world politics is a million miles away from people’s simplistic views of force structures.
When Churchill was warning Britain about the rise of Germany in the middle and late thirties a lot of people called him a fool and a scaremonger. He was right. When he warned about the rise o communism they did it again. He was right…again. Now, I’m no Churchill but I do not understand why you constantly attack me for warning of the threats that face us. The UK’s armed forces are in the worst position they have been in for decades and yet you persist in saying we can do anything that is needed. We can’t.
Our Armed Force’s are not in the worst position. You and others are just obsessed with numbers and headline figures. And don’t understand the capability and effects our equipment and people can generate. Are our Force’s too small? Yes. Are most of our allies too small? Yes. You can not compare the past to today. Conflicts of the future will be fought very differently from today. If NATO was fully engaged in the Ukraine conflict, it would look very different. It isn’t going to be the UK on our own against Russia or China. And if we did meet these nations on an equal front deployed far from home, we would win. We are still officially classed as the world’s 5th most capable Armed Force’s. Our biggest issue is recruitment and retention. But all nations are suffering these problems. Even the US. The moans I see because we ‘only’ have 8 F35’s on the QE for a local area deployment this year. Completely forgetting these are 8 of the most capable fast jets on the planet. Other nations also only commit 6-8 aircraft for such exercises. I am not in denial about the problems facing our Armed Force’s. But they are far more capable and deadly than people think. We will never be back to 1980/90’s numbers of fast jets, warships, and Army regiments. But today’s capability would eclipse our Force’s from that era. And we have an enormous equipment program in place over the coming few years. I have experienced what our Force’s can do at first hand. You can go back to the early 2000’s, and people moaned we were to small then, everything is crap, we need the new kit now not in 5 years time ect ect. I can guarantee you this. None of our allies look at us and think we are not capable or a force to be reckoned with. Our reputation overseas is still first class. 🇬🇧
Very good Robert, but you have made a serious mistake in your post. You actually agreed with me when you said ” Are our forces too small, Yes”. If you look through all the comments I have made over the years you will find only two themes. One is that our forces are too small and that politicians of all parties should get there arse in gear to improve the position and secondly that the men and women who go to war should have the best kit and should be well looked after. If you can find anything materially different you can crticise me, otherwise stop being so pedantic about everything I say. 🙄
But I can understand that our Force’s are not going to get any larger. Key areas need an increase. The RFA, the submarine service for example. We will not see the Army increase to 100k again. And like I said. Today’s Armed Force’s would eclipse our Force’s from the 80/90’s even though they were considerably larger. Capability is everything Geoff. And looking at Russias performance in Ukraine, NATO would them out.
Well worryingly if one analyses what’s written it seems the Carney was unable or unwilling to shoot down but a fraction of the registered threats, just fortunate the hits were relatively inocuous. Will these that continue to be the case as the weapons become more deadly one fears. Will a T-45 be able to do better? Big question was the problem in eliminating these threats fundamentally range, an assessment of the actual danger or lack of actual capability?
The Carney has the latest block II SM3 upgrade, but each missile is in excess of 30 million USD, and you usually fire 2 in a ballistic engagement. Sadly the math isn’t in favor of defending merchant shipping with missiles that expensive. A city yes, a dry bulk carrier, no.
The UK has air dominance should it need it, A carrier with f-35 is more than capable of defending UK interest. I would call Iran out on the whole su-35 scheme. Im sure we have knights of the air who are excited at the thought of doing battle with a Russian contractor. You don’t really think Russia is going to give away its prized jets without some kind of insurance. UK and Us need to get a hold of this issue and start declaring no fly zones. If Iranian airspace was off limits to commercial jetliners what is Iran going to do. The loss of revenue would be staggering, more than the cost of a few cargo vessels.
Both. If a threat exists you have to be able to cope or you have to withdraw because of that threat. Remember POW and Repulse sunk in the east, most likely because they had no air cover. If an Ashleigh Burke can’t cope then a T45 isn’t going to do any better.
So now we have to rely (even more) on the US to protect UK shipping interests, cos we aint got no boats to do it ourselves?
We have 6 warships in the gulf area right now, how many other countries have 6 warships in the gulf region?
None of the ships are British flagged or even British owned. They are just owned by Isle of Man and Bermuda based holding companies to dodge tax.
They have zero to do with the UK.
Which ships Jim?
3x minesweeps, 1x LSA, 1x t-23 and 1x T-45 on way but only last 2 could ctually protect against drone/missiles
Thanks Steve. So effectively one frigate and one un-modernised T45 on the way? And the Gulf is about 100,000 square miles? I thinl we’re in trouble if the sh.. hits the fan.
We do not have 6 rocket firing ships in the Gulf or Red sea, at this moment in time!
The only people with that many combatants in the Gulf region are the yanks and the people who actually live there. We are way ahead of most countries by having one permanently deployed there. Our naval priorities are in Europe currently, the fact we can even have ships deploying to the Gulf in numbers as well is remarkable and should be celebrated – not scrutinized as we can’t match to US hull for hull.
1 ASW 1 AAW and 3 MCM and a support ship. That’s a sea control task force. If the rebels start dropping mines instead of missiles that Burke won’t be much use. Not all warships fire missiles.
UNITY EXPLORER is a Bahamas flagged, U.K. owned and operated. – U.S. Central Command.
M/V NUMBER 9 …. The Panamanian flagged, Bermuda and U.K. owned and operated – U.S. Central Command.
https://www.centcom.mil/MEDIA/PRESS-RELEASES/Press-Release-View/Article/3605010/houthi-attacks-on-commercial-shipping-in-international-water-continue/
For all the use they are, canoes would be cheaper.
Our new Zealand canoe navy could paddle over and do a mean haka if it would help? We would have to do a few sausage sizzles to raise the funds but all the baddies will pack up and go home after our war dance so it will be worth the wait.
👍hahahaha Top comment!
its not a question of if this is gonna esculate into full scale war its when
Are the Iran’s going to go a step further at some point hitting UK flagged Vessel or some European ship ? Interesting to see what happens when a Type 45 arrives on the since .Hope not but we may fine out what there really can do and not just on paper . 🇬🇧
Send the fighter jets from Cyprus for missile fires in Yemen
More concerned about it breaking down. Diamond doesn’t have a good track record.
Ever been ro sea in a hostile environment? Probably not. Another armchair muppet.
It’s winter the sea is cold
As far as l saw in report, not European ones, the Carney was seriously damaged by a drone…. Interestingly not a word about it in the report above…. The internet is full of footages in this regard… Not sure why the constant lying
Why did the USS Carney not shoot down the missiles too?
Where are our Navel presence in Red Sea?
“We have every reason to believe…”
– oh, well then that must be true.
US and UK propaganda are killing people everywhere
Which is why the T31s were such a good idea; Bofors, Camm, Wildcat with Martlet – now demonstrated AA capability I believe. Better late than never I suppose.
Was the Carney not capable of engaging the missiles, just the drones?
I think the Houthi need a dose of Tomahawk. Then, if they do not give it up? A serious dose of B52.
Gunboat diplomacy of the 21 century.
Lord Palmerston would be proud.
As for guns and boats, I think Western powers should seek an optimum balance between quantity and quality, range and spread, sophistication and affordability. The attrition rate of weapons platforms in modern war is being shown to be orders of magnitude higher than most Western powers can currently sustain. Ditto the expenditure rate of ordnance and supplies of all types.
Therefore, it is vital to rethink our Post-Cold War “peace dividend” approach to military build-up, in a world of fast-deteriorating security and increasingly complex military requirements. We need more lower-level ships for greater overall survivability of the navy, and more basic ordnance for engaging smaller, cheaper targets that may come in swarms. Force protection is also of critical value, and a coordinated defense by multiple platforms using layered and mutual responses may be more effective and efficient than trusting in singlular massive platfirms with expensive yet exhaustible munitions. Similar arrangements on land.
Bollards. It’s the Iranians that need a B52 reality check; what is the hold they have over the septics, that prevents the septics giving them a new ice age?
The missile launch sites should be targeted and destroyed in response to these blatant acts of aggression on defenceless ships and their crews.
Just needs a Shahed drone to hit a US warship and I predict the Shahed factory will disappear in a massive explosion.
WW3 is on its way.
US has been after Iran for a long long g time and its oil reserves. Expect false flags, CIA backed rebels firing on US warships