DSEI 2021 – BAE Systems is showcasing its latest CV90 with the new D-series turret.

This is the first time the upgraded digital turret has been unveiled and represents a leap forward in design and functionality. Recently selected by the Royal Netherlands Army as part of an extensive $500 million mid-life upgrade program for the CV9035NL, the new turret configuration is also included in the CV90 MkIV offer for the Czech Republic.

According to the firm:

“Developed by BAE Systems Hägglunds in Örnsköldsvik, Sweden, the turret on display at DSEI is a 50mm gun. The main weapon position is changed to provide even better vehicle balance and enable new ways to introduce a variety of weaponry for increased lethality. It also offers significant ergonomic improvements to benefit the vehicle’s crew. The enhanced turret design is built on years of combat-proven experience, continuous vehicle improvements, and data analysis from the CV90 User Club – the seven nations currently operating CV90 fleets.”

“We are extremely proud to display the new D-series turret at DSEI to demonstrate the latest technology on the combat-proven CV90 platform,” said Tommy Gustafsson-Rask, managing director of BAE Systems Hägglunds.

“The new turret configuration provides CV90 crews with improved protection and increased combat efficiency. It represents our continued commitment to delivering the most modern, advanced Infantry Fighting Vehicle that meets our customers’ requirements now and in the future.”

The CV90 is also equipped with Elbit Systems’ Iron Fist Active Protection System solution and an integrated, Rafael Advanced Defense Systems’ SPIKE-LR long-range anti-tank guided missile. Other significant improvements include the latest generation of sensors, Artificial Intelligence and Augmented Reality software to increase the CV90s multi-domain capabilities on the battlefield.

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Ian M
Ian M
27 days ago

Wait for it…………………………………………….

Bulkhead
Bulkhead
27 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Bated breath

Dan
Dan
27 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

You mean “look what you could have had” ?

Ian M
Ian M
27 days ago
Reply to  Dan

  :wpds_wink: 

Spyinthesky
Spyinthesky
27 days ago
Reply to  Dan

Geez superficially this just looks so much better and available doesn’t it and if we had ordered it it would likely have been built in the UK and kept Bae committed to its UK base instead of selling out. Talk about shot to the foot… and then the other one for good measure while spiting your nose. Or am I simply being naive here?

Ron5
Ron5
27 days ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

Not in the least. Buying CV90 would have been the logical thing to do instead of Ajax.

Hamish
Hamish
26 days ago
Reply to  Ron5

Our numpties in MoD are logical?

Quentin D63
Quentin D63
27 days ago

Waiting for it… Lol 😁… Okay, I’ll let someone else to say it!.. 😆

KPB
KPB
27 days ago

These look rubbish, let’s keep Ajax!

Damo
Damo
27 days ago
Reply to  KPB

That’s right. Best of british! If you don’t want Ajax you’re a Guardian reading soy latte drinking gender non specific individual or collective pronoun of treason!!!!

Jason M Holmes
Jason M Holmes
27 days ago
Reply to  Damo

lol

Peter wait
Peter wait
25 days ago
Reply to  Damo

The only recon vehicle that needs its own bridge layer lol

Ian M
Ian M
24 days ago
Reply to  Peter wait

A bridge layer version has been demo’d.

john melling
john melling
27 days ago

The situation with AJAX looks grim I have to admit.
We either solve the problems quickly or scrap them
We would be stupid to ignore the potential of CV90

Jacko
Jacko
27 days ago
Reply to  john melling

You mean like we did before?

john melling
john melling
27 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

Yep 😂

Peter wait
Peter wait
26 days ago
Reply to  john melling

Hard to cure badly made hulls of varying dimensions? Wonder why they did not pick the CTA 40 cannon?

Nigel Collins
Nigel Collins
21 days ago
Reply to  john melling

This is very interesting news, I wonder what will be next on the agenda?

“A third-scale 8×8 demonstrator developed over the past two years under a GBP3 million (USD4.09 million) research programme, the MTR is designed to showcase the significant mobility advantages offered by electric drive that could be exploited by the next generation of British Army armoured fighting vehicles (AFVs).”

https://www.janes.com/defence-news/land-forces/latest/dsei-2021-qinetiqdstl-team-debuts-mobility-test-rig

Damo
Damo
27 days ago

Judging from Afghanistan reports the cannon is very effective. Looks to have withstood a few IED detonations too (not all of course) which is encouraging

Spyinthesky
Spyinthesky
27 days ago
Reply to  Damo

However Ajax is designed to be so cumbersome that the IEDs go off before it gets there.

Jack
Jack
27 days ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

The violent vibrations trigger the explosion long before the vehicle gets close enough to be damaged.😆

Nigel Collins
Nigel Collins
27 days ago
Reply to  Jack

And the crew won’t hear the IED explode!

david
david
23 days ago
Reply to  Nigel Collins

Also the vibratory white finger will allow them to feel reduced pain when it happens!

Jason M Holmes
Jason M Holmes
27 days ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

Perhaps insurgents get hearing problems from being too close to AJAX, sonic warfare!

Ron5
Ron5
27 days ago
Reply to  Damo

That cannon has never been to Afghanistan.

Damo
Damo
27 days ago
Reply to  Ron5

Yeah you’re right. I read the bit about the Norwegian vehicles. Was talking cv90 in general

Spyinthesky
Spyinthesky
27 days ago

I reckon Bae are just mocking us now.

Paul.P
Paul.P
27 days ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

Yeh, taking the Michael…..and who can blame them😂

Bringer of Facts
Bringer of Facts
27 days ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

Yep.

Bringer of Facts
Bringer of Facts
27 days ago

Ah the timing … just as news is being widely broadcast about the failure of Ajax. The CV90 shown here looks like the AFV we need to buy.

Rob
Rob
27 days ago

The Netherlands & Czech Republic, lacking economies of scale, buy off the shelf and end up with this.

The UK, believing we are an economy of scale, go for bespoke options and end up with AJAX.

When will we learn….

AlexS
AlexS
27 days ago
Reply to  Rob

See the bright side. it is good for identity.

Last edited 27 days ago by AlexS
AlexS
AlexS
27 days ago

So:

50mm gun
2 Spike LR missiles (5km range from land)
Ironfist APS

Seems okay…meanwhile…

Graham
Graham
18 days ago
Reply to  AlexS

Great spec for a Strike vehicle. Now we just need to source a small-signature transportable, agile, recce vehicle.

BB85
BB85
27 days ago

I know it’s a very minor point but the headlights in cv90 are still very 90s. You’d think they would upgrade with some led’s and get ride of the plastic orange indicator spot light.

Nigel Collins
Nigel Collins
27 days ago

On a separate note.

“Rheinmetall BAE Systems Land (RBSL) and Rheinmetall have unveiled a mortar-carrying mission module for the Boxer 8×8 wheeled armoured fighting vehicle at the 2021 DSEI exhibition held from 14 to 17 September in London.”

https://www.janes.com/defence-news/land-forces/latest/dsei-2021-rbsl-and-rheinmetall-unveil-boxer-mortar-module

RobW
RobW
26 days ago
Reply to  Nigel Collins

It seems the mortars are fired through doors that open at the top of the vehicle. What could go wrong?

Nigel Collins
Nigel Collins
26 days ago
Reply to  RobW

Hopefully, nothing!

Graham
Graham
18 days ago
Reply to  RobW

Nothing. This has been achieved before with FV432 and 81mm mortar.

Andrew Thorne
Andrew Thorne
27 days ago

Would have preferred a statement “Ajax cancelled in favour of CV90”

Andrew D
Andrew D
27 days ago

Time for the MOD to make their mind up 🤔

David Steeper
David Steeper
27 days ago
Reply to  Andrew D

What mind ? Sorry too easy. True but easy.

Gary
Gary
27 days ago

Does look the part, we done a u turn with Boxer! The CV90 appears to be a better candidate for AFV (six dismounts instead of four Ares-Ajax).The rationale regarding the CR2 upgrade was because of ammo (Cost). The CV90 uses the tried and trusted Bofors 40 mm gun (From WWII). The rationale of the Ajax was mainly recce. But our requirements have sine changed. But I do wonder if all the money spent on the caseless system for Ajax was wasted (higher ammo cost?). The Americans seem to be going large with the trusted Bushmaster series (MK III 50mm). I… Read more »

Ian M
Ian M
27 days ago
Reply to  Gary

Hi Gary, CT40 isn’t caseless, it’s a “telescoped” round where the projectile is inside the propellant case. Makes it much shorter than an equivalent 40mm round meaning more can be stored and fitted into an AHS.
cheers

Gary
Gary
27 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Sorry Ian my bad. I should have said Cased Telescoped. Was rushing and was just thinking no brass in my minds eye. £70million were procured for the warrior effort which was cancelled. Hopefully it can be retro fitted into the Boxer. Though I read they were to be ‘disposed’ of. The point I was trying to make.. i’ve heard its had problems in testing. In hindsight it might be a headache like the CR2 rifled ammo turned out long term. Especially if the trend is to now go bigger (harder to retro fit than bushmaster). I just passionately want the… Read more »

Ian M
Ian M
27 days ago
Reply to  Gary

Over 4000 40mm rnds down the range so far, works very well!

Peter wait
Peter wait
26 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

How many barrels ?

Ian M
Ian M
24 days ago
Reply to  Peter wait

Just the one…..smoothbore now like CR3.

peter Wait
peter Wait
15 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

It is a telescoped round, in the time it takes to travel out its case and seal blow-by strips material away from the barrel. You are delusional as its been reported that 700 rounds is the typical life and about £200 per round due to the complexity of manufacture and limited market!

Ian M
Ian M
15 days ago
Reply to  peter Wait

You obviously don’t recognise humour.

peter Wait
peter Wait
16 days ago
Reply to  Peter wait

fifty seven seem about right ?

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
27 days ago
Reply to  Gary

Rationale for CR2 upgrade was mounting obsolescene of nearly everything (it had not been properly upgraded since fielding in 1996) – and diminished lethality of gun/ammo.

Warrior upgrade (WCSP) scrapped to save money – but surely just as much would be spent on buying additional Boxers to replace them.

Should we replace a tracked SP gun with a truck mounted one? I think we need boyj a tracked and a wheeled SP Gun.

Gary
Gary
27 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Agree, ideally we have both tracked & wheeled. But for the strike concept, I think wheeled gives us the mobility to get to the fight early and we can get some capability now with an off the shelf cost (No nasty surprises). In some conflicts tracked won’t be needed or take weeks to mobilize. Boxer is well suited to Strike, however I fear the army doesn’t have the funds in place to go beyond the baseline and really get the firepower needed. CR2 still shows its pedigree. Which is a miracle because other countries have upgraded multiple times whilst CR2… Read more »

Peter wait
Peter wait
26 days ago
Reply to  Gary

American Airforce lab’s spent nearly forty years trying to make CTA cannons work and over 200 million dollars!

Graham
Graham
18 days ago
Reply to  Gary

You don’t need a lot of dismounts for a recce vehicle.

Coll
Coll
27 days ago

Is it me, or has BAE increase the promotion of the CV-90 since the AJAX problems started?

John Clark
John Clark
27 days ago
Reply to  Coll

Looks that way Coll. But if the MOD bought the CV90 as an Ajax replacement, the usual meddling would take place, they would find a way of making it twice as heavy, so obese it would be unable to navigate a speed bump and rattle the crew to death at a sedate 20mph…..

Quentin D63
Quentin D63
27 days ago
Reply to  Coll

Lol. Yes, timing was impeccable. Obviously this development has been going on in the background for a while. I wonder how the Ajax’s CT40mm rates against the CV 50mm? Anyone here know?

Ian M
Ian M
27 days ago
Reply to  Quentin D63

Ct40 rounds are more compact in size, therefore more can be carried in an AHS and as stored rounds in the turret. Ballistically, the 40mm CT round has performance similar to larger calibre rounds. From CTAi: ARMOUR PIERCING FIN STABILISED DISCARDING SABOT TRACERThe Armour Piercing Fin Stabilised Discarding Sabot – Tracer (APFSDS-T) is able to penetrate more than 140 mm of RHA (Rolled Homogeneous Armour) at 1500 m. This sub-calibre dart can defeat all light armoured vehicles, infantry fighting vehicles, including those heavily protected with advanced add-on armour. APFSDS-T Product qualified in 2014 CHARACTERISTICS DIMENSIONS 65 x 255 mm AMMUNITION MASS 1900 g PROJECTILE MASS 550 g INITIAL… Read more »

qwerty
qwerty
27 days ago

PLEASE CAN WE JUST GET THESE AJAX IS SHIT

OOA
OOA
27 days ago

Call it a Cvajax and hope nobody notices.

Quentin D63
Quentin D63
27 days ago
Reply to  OOA

Like this!

simon richards
simon richards
27 days ago

Scrap Ajax get this

Quentin D63
Quentin D63
27 days ago
Reply to  simon richards

Why have just a GPMG, 30 or 40 mm when you have a 50mm plus a couple of ATGMs!

Jason M Holmes
Jason M Holmes
27 days ago

Ooooh this looks very tasty, if only…….

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli
27 days ago

Size looks more sensible. What do I know? Just looks the part.

BAE mocking the IDIOTS in HMG and MoD.

Mike
Mike
27 days ago

We are still using CVRT. Almost anything would be better right now, and any replacement is still years away. The future for armoured reconnaissance needs investment badly.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli
26 days ago
Reply to  Mike

I’m reading that Scimitar retirement has been brought forward!

Mike
Mike
26 days ago

To be replaced with what i wonder?

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
9 days ago

Any more on that story Danielle? It doesn’t make sense when there is no ready replacement…except that we had a capability gap for the carrier (RN), MPA (RAF) …..perhaps it is the army’s turn to have a 10 year capbility gap!

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli
9 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Warrior?!

Paul
Paul
27 days ago

Given our current doctrine seems to be to up armour, increase defensive suites etc and let the poor squaddies / matelots sit back and soak up damage to give the mandarins time to issue a stiffly worded letter, god forbid providing them with kit that might be able to manoeuvre and fire back effectively

Hamish
Hamish
26 days ago

Let’s buy this then….Oh wait we have Ajax…No we don’t….Yes we do…Seriously let’s just buy something that bloody well works.

Johan
Johan
26 days ago

OK looks great in photos and in the Sales Brochure, but don’t forget BAEs had there chance and missed it.

HINDSIGHT
there trying to sell it to the Czech and what other front line country has them.

BAEs was not that interested in winning, just screwing the MOD

they are all as bad as each other

David Barry
David Barry
15 days ago
Reply to  Johan

This platform is used by multiple NATO partners, Scandics, Balts, Danes, Dutch…

Peter wait
Peter wait
26 days ago

Are these available in uneven lengths like Ajax ?

the_marquis
the_marquis
26 days ago

Interesting seeing CV90, Ajax and Challenger all under one roof…the difference in size was stark.

Ajax is such a massive lump, it makes the Challenger look svelte. It’s certainly a different approach to the recce role from Scimitar, and given what’s been bolted on, it’s not surprising it’s had troubles.

CV90’s reduced silhouette, on the other hand, seems more appropriate for a reconnaissance vehicle; but then, would it have fared any better than Ajax once all the extra kit has been added?

Jason M Holmes
Jason M Holmes
25 days ago
Reply to  the_marquis

Agreed, Ajax seems unnecessarily large for ‘recon’, I never understood why they chose it for that role.

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
9 days ago
Reply to  Jason M Holmes

I always thought that the TRACER programme enabled the Yanks to persuade our chaps that you need a big Bradley CFV size vehicle to do recce.

George Parker
George Parker
25 days ago

George, leap forward in design and function is enough. No need for “..ality.” We are not American.

Hugh Jarce
Hugh Jarce
17 days ago

So fire rounds like AHEAD that explode and send out 152 tungsten projectiles per round and all those sensors are ruined, rendering the vehicle completely blind and defenceless.

Hell, even paintball rounds would probably blind the sensors too, especially if they contained superglue and small chaff-like metal strips.

Plus when in use, these sensors are going to get covered in mud, dust, sand and dead insects. Surely they need windscreen wipers to keep them clean?

Last edited 17 days ago by Hugh Jarce
Ian M
Ian M
15 days ago
Reply to  Hugh Jarce

Dear Mr Jarce, all optics on modern AFV’s have a wash/wipe system.

Hugh Jarce
Hugh Jarce
15 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

OK thanks. How does it work, because I can’t see wipers in the photo.

Ian M
Ian M
14 days ago
Reply to  Hugh Jarce

Mr Jarce,
Conceivably, either a radius type, like on a car or possibly a vertical sweep (as on the Thales sights used on AJAX), in which case the wiper arm is likely hidden at the bottom of the sight window. Some sights don’t have physical wiper arms, relying on high pressure water jets to provide the cleaning function.

cheers

Hugh Jarce
Hugh Jarce
14 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Thanks for the explanation.
Can you explain what you mean by “radius type” please?

Ian M
Ian M
12 days ago
Reply to  Hugh Jarce

Like on a car

Hugh Jarce
Hugh Jarce
12 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Yeah, I know, you said car in your other post, but I don’t know what this is or how it works. Do you have a link so I can read up on it?

Stu
Stu
13 days ago

Can we see the MoD growing a pair, admitting Ajax is garbage and bailing on the contract? That would mean admitting they made a mistake… If they have the minerals, CV90 is a great option & has a lot of variants already developed. 2nd point – Forgive me if I misremember but – didn’t the MoD use the Australian Land 400 phase 2 testing to justify the choice of Boxer with minimal “tender process”? The Boxer that can be fitted and has been tested with the Lance 2.0 turret? The same turret used on the Lynx? The Lynx that’s in… Read more »

Last edited 13 days ago by Stu
Ian M
Ian M
12 days ago
Reply to  Stu

Nope

Stu
Stu
12 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Constructive. Thanks. 😐

Ian M
Ian M
12 days ago
Reply to  Stu

What can I say? You asked the question, I replied. However, to be constructive, I will say that the MOD is so heavily invested in the entire AJAX programme, not just the platforms themselves but the training aids, support contracts and building works that to drop the system now, then invest further hard won cash into another completely different programme would be political suicide. It’s not as simple as just popping down to Evans Halshaw and part-exing your motor because you don’t like the old one anymore. The training aids associated with the AJAX system of vehicles are radical and… Read more »

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
9 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Ian, the MoD invested a lot in the Nimrod AEW programme, the Nimrod MRA4 programme, (and further back – SP70, P1154, TSR-2, CVA-01, MBT-80 etc – and cancelled. They will pull the plug if its the only way – and say farewell to £billions and years worth of work. BTW, I hope the army would know how to use Ajax – they have used armoured recce vehicles before. Ian, the MoD invested a lot in the Nimrod AEW programme, the Nimrod MRA4 programme, (and further back – SP70, P1154, TSR-2, CVA-01, MBT-80 etc – and cancelled. They will pull the… Read more »

Last edited 9 days ago by Graham Moore
Ian M
Ian M
9 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Hi Graham,
You are of course correct in mentioning those other past programmes that were canned. Nothing is guaranteed with politicians, I accept. My reference as to how the Army will use AJAX is based around the “Strike” fiasco and some contacts with the MOD who STILL think that AJAX is a medium tank, very worrying!
cheers
Ian

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
8 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Your contacts in MoD who think the Ajax is a medium tank scare me – they should not be allowed near policy making or decision making. Reminds me of the media types who insisted on calling Scimitar and Scorpion ‘light tanks’ – infuriating. Ajax is a medium (weight) AFV. It is not a tank. Another commentator to these pages thought that Strike as a concept was passe. Unbelievable – it was only just getting started. Although I have not seen even a definition of ‘Strike’ from MoD. I think the CVR(T) family was excellent – a full family of low-cost,… Read more »

Ian M
Ian M
8 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Hi Graham, I’m intimately aware of the CVRT family of vehicles. I was a CET in the REME for 24 years and worked on Striker to component level (as we did in those days) and taught Scimitar sighting systems for years too. Luckily, my MOD contact has been promoted (sideways probably) onto a submarine programme, lord help us. GD UK have demonstrated a Striker like ARES with a Brimstone fit, I don’t know if the MOD will go for it but it would definitely fill that long range gap we have. As far as lightweight platforms go, I watched the… Read more »

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
8 days ago
Reply to  Ian M

Hi Ian, I was in REME too but I apparently didn’t work for a living as I was an officer. My first civvy job after leaving was at Abbey Wood so I know how procurement is done. Why was Striker canned without replacement? Are there Sabres still at BATUS as OPFOR? Will Ajax be canned? What would we buy instead? Why is it taking Industry to 2030 to convert CR2s to CR3 when a Base workshop could do it quicker? Its good to chat. Arte et mate.

Ian M
Ian M
8 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Hi Graham, Isn’t procurement at Abbey Wood one of those oxymorons? Just joking! I think Striker was canned because the Swingfire missiles had come to end of life and couldn’t be upgraded or refurbished. The Infantry would supply the ATGW with MILAN (which I also worked on). Wiki has the SABRE withdrawn from service in 2004. AJAX is now in the hands of the SRO, Mr. Marsh, Swampy to his friends, so there’s no way of knowing anytime soon. CV90 is a good platform but the time to add on and integrate all of the MODs requirements, sights, electronic architecture,… Read more »

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
9 days ago

It looks the part – and is ready now. Anyone know the latest on the Ajax story. I thought GDLUK had passed the deadline to put a ‘get well’ plan forward to DE&S.

Graham Moore
Graham Moore
8 days ago
Reply to  Graham Moore

Answering my own question! Mr David Marsh has been appointed SRO for the Ajax programme. See Defense News.