Workers will refuse overtime work in the ongoing dispute over pay and conditions.
GMB union has today announced that members at Rolls Royce’s submarine programme in Derby have backed an escalation in the ongoing industrial action facing the company.
Workers will now engage in an overtime ban, meaning company managers will not be able to call on staff to fulfil already groaning order books outside of contracted hours.
An overtime ban will come into place from Friday 31 May for one month.
Mick Coppin, GMB Organiser, said:
“Rolls Royce is a British institution as well as being a hugely profitable company. Sadly Rolls Royce bosses have refused to do what’s right by the high skilled and dedicated workforce that do so much for Rolls Royce.
All whilst the UK should be promoting it’s manufacturing capabilities across the globe. An overtime ban will have a huge impact on company orders at a time when order books are groaning. It’s time to end this and get back around the table with an offer that respects the vital contribution these workers make.”
Great. What perfect, but I’m sure accidental (?), timing. 😏
RR almost went bust during COVID. Only last year did things start to pick up again. So much so, that they started to repay the £5bn+ debt they accumulated. They still have around £3bn debt, so how does that make them hugely profitable. Perhaps when the debt is cleared the Union can say that..
Projected? ABC gave me a good reply. Have a read.
Oh please don’t be silly, and see Reds under the beds or conspiracy theories, the GMB Engineers at RR Submarines are all very highly vetted, most are shareholders and it’s incredibly rare they ever do this sort of thing.
Bottom line is they are annoyed, but being polite about it !
This Pay Dispute has been going on since last year so it is just the way things go. They aren’t going on Strike just not doing any overtime (work to rule).
It’s very complicated but it all boils down to effectively having 2 very different Rolls Royce’s here in Derby.
One builds Aircraft Engines which is high precision mass manufacturing on a very large scale.
The other is the absolute pinnacle of Engineering and Technology, it involves checks and controls on multiple levels and some of those processes are critically dangerous. Quite simply if you make a mistake it can get lots of folks killed.
We have a new CEO who is very good and doing a superb job with a Macro restructure, increased efficiency and cost control. But he doesn’t entirely understand the complexity of what they do (not surprising as half the site is strictly off limits to him).
So trying to get away with a one size fits all pay rise is seriously stupid when you are dealing with completely different industry’s and skill sets.
Especially when the company share price is through the roof, paying excellent dividends has 30 years of guaranteed high value work. And we have a massive skills shortage which can only be met by internal Training of suitably vetted UK Workers.
I’m retired ex GMB but also a shareholder (most of RR staff are), but I’m very firmly with the GMB engineers.
So the huge turbofans on an A350 or 777 aren’t the absolute pinnacle and building them without checks and controls won’t kill lots of folks?
Get over yourself.
It seems a good case, to me.
There is a practical difference between mass production of precision-engineered equipment using established procedures, and developing niche systems from scratch where you essentially have to devise the procedures as you go.
No they aren’t the pinnacle, but they build the finest Aero and Marine engines in the world. The tolerances, precision and QC are extremely high, hence the safety record.
But it’s not in the same league as on Raynesway, hence the reason why RR Submarine either picks the best engineers from Aero or recruits and trains internally.
I have been involved here in Derby with both and am 3rd generation,2 generations did the transition and I assure you the checks and controls are far higher due to the Risk factors.
And they absolutely have to be due to the nature of the beast.
I remember when I was told the main difference, it’s stayed with me since.
There are 2 processes onsite, both of which require separate Nuclear licences.
The 1st is the design and production of the reactor and core. It’s not that different from Aero but the precision, materials used and QC are far higher.
The 2nd is the production of the Fuel Pellets which power the reactor. The Material still has to be machined but to even higher tolerances but it has to be done remotely by various methods. The material is not only deadly and worked on in an isolated and secure environment but its quantity has to be minutely and securely controlled during each stage of the process, otherwise it is cataclysmic.
As I was told in plain terms the difference is !
If you F**k up on Aero a few hundred folks may die, but they have multiple engines. So probably not.
If you F**k up in here you can either blow a very large hole in part of the world or kill everyone around us, including your own family. So definitely yes !
As for getting over myself 🤷🏼♂️ Please tell me that when the material is HEU which is Bomb Grade U235, you do get that lots of people getting killed, means a magnitude above a plane crash.
Very interesting and informative, could you elaborate please on the 2 different types, I get one builds aircrafts im not quite sure what the other is please ?
Thanks for the explanation., which I would bee “silly” to ignore. One question though, and I am being serious. If the majority of the engineers are shareholders why have they decided to work to rule? It has to affect them surely.
It’s not a silly question at all, and I’ll try and give you a worthy explanation.
RR Submarines is a fairly small niche part of RR, it’s not highly profitable and has little effect on the corporate accounts. it’s that and the bulging order books for everything else that drives the share price. So no effect whatsoever due to this very limited action.
What would affect that is if this escalates to a full on strike, because RR Submarines is incredibly vital how RR corporate is structured.
What usually happens is a big strike affects the share price and it goes downwards and in a world full of Corporate Asset strippers that can result in take overs and companies being stripped bare.
RR Submarines and BAe up at Barrow are the sole producers of U.K. Nuclear Submarines (plus the supply chain), hence why they are so incredibly vital to RR and BAe.
Both were privatised but HMG kept 1 share in each of them and its the corporate equivalent of a Fully Comp Insurance Policy.
The Golden shares ensure no one can take them over without HMG say so.
Most of us have shares and keep them long term as a nest egg and too occasionally upset the Shareholders meetings by turning up.
So that wouldn’t have affected how folks voted and the size of the vote indicates just how annoyed they are.
To be honest what probably caused some to pause was the overtime £££’s, it always amazed me how the impending Holiday season affects folks long term thinking.
”Sorry Duck but Bali is off the cards this year, it’s Skegvegas !”
RR in UK is a bit of an oddity when compared to the majority of U.K. businesses. It still has a lot of generational workers and the sense of pride and loyalty among those is very high. A cousin and I followed 2 Uncles and 3 Aunts and both uncles followed their Dads.
I was a teenager the day RR went bust, it was a devastating episode and that memory still affects the way people think. Thankfully HMG stepped in and saved the day, but that memory still affects attitudes, the workforce are very conservative in how they think and act.
Yes there are lots of shareholders amongst the workforce and you really have to go some to annoy them enough to overwhelmingly vote for limited industrial action. Which does tell you something about why they are annoyed.
Bottom line is the pay offer was derisory and everyone knew it. What makes matters worse is the massive amounts of money being invested on expansion and replacement of the old infrastructure. Over the next 20 years the workforce has to double (hence all the new apprentices). So don’t do all that and then insult the existing ones by offering them a lower % rise than the drivers of the logistic firm RR uses to drive parts around between sites 😡.
I don’t think there will be a strike as both sides know that escalation isn’t in anyone’s interest. IMHO RR will be forced to shift their position or risk the wrath of their customers, and I suspect that will happen post GE.
I don’t think that the RR senior managers have quite got used to the Brave New post AUKUS World and they need to adapt their thinking accordingly.
They now have 2 separate Governments as customers, not just the good old UK MOD tied to their sole supplier in a nice cosy relationship.
Their new customer isn’t exactly known for its diplomacy when it comes to dealing with Brits and has a track record of just walking away.
The other factor is that they have a highly skilled workforce, and taken them for granted for decades. Simple reason for that is long term stability, job security and you can’t just walk off elsewhere.
What has now changed is that some are now beginning to see better opportunities elsewhere and they can now take those. They now have a legal opportunity to stay within the Nuclear industry but with much better weather, way higher pay and where engineers are actually valued and treated with respect and not just like Tyre fitters.
So bottom line is there will be a settlement it just may take a wee while.
Hope that helps.
Thank you. I think your posts, particularly the second, is probably the most useful and sensible explanation of a dispute I’ve read. Not only for the current situation but for the insight into RR itself. I wish you well.🙂
M8 I’m retired 3 years now, but I was a shop steward and we would avoid conflict like the plague. We were genuinely proud of what we did and why it was necessary, only thing we asked was a fair reward and a bit of respect.
Unlikely as it may seem I was a branch secretary with a sub of NATSOPA back in the seventies. I learnt a lot about my union ,most of which I didn’t like, so maybe it’s coloured my attitude.
I ended up moving from GMB as my job role had progressed over to management ! I actually ended up in prospect which I have to say was less a traditional Trades Union and more a mutual support confederation populated by grown ups !
👍🙂
They hired a CEO who couldn’t get security vetting, or are they just so new it hasn’t come through yet?
Neither he is Turkish, so will never get that clearance ! I should explain that in no way is that a derogative statement because as CEO he doesn’t need to know the nuts and bolts.
As I said he is excellent at what he is doing, and I fully support what he is doing with Corporate RR.
What he does need to know is that the workers in that particular part of the business do have that clearance and it costs more to employ them.
Well explained mate.
It’s damned hard sometimes ☹️
I can’t comment on the engineering side, as I have no knowledge. However, you state RR pays excellent dividends, this is not true. There have been no dividends since before COVID. Maybe they’ll come back next year, who knows. You also say the share price is through the roof. Well for those that held long term shares, they might say after tanking during COVID, they are now starting to see their investments paying off.
Hmm, H&W are having IR issues with GMB members as well over the attempt to move from a 4 day week with overtime for Friday to a 5 day week.
Mmm I was a GMB steward once and I find that ridiculous. It may just explain why H&W went down the pan and the likes of RR and BAe didn’t.
I’m not saying it’s perfect, because it isn’t but it’s better than that.
IMHO If you really want to see a better system, increase productivity and have better ER.
Just legislate that a Standard working week is 40 hours averaged out over a year, with a certain % bonus for working a 2 shift system, another % for a 3 shift system (inc nights), and another for continental 12 hour shifts (inc nights), that’s 3 x 12, followed by 4 x 12, swap over and repeat.
One caveat all managers below Board level do likewise !
[ already groaning order books ]
surely one should not keep on bidding for or taking orders, when you know that you cannot deliver on time or price agreed.
just saying like..
Have you ver run a business? Trust me it’s very dangerous to turn business away, , but this dispute is about the unions wanting to cut hours that they would normally work. That’s where the problem lies.
No it’s not it’s cutting hours they would voluntarily do above their contractual hours for a premium. It’s actually costing them £££’s.
OK . Badly phrased re.the engineers but I do think the taking the business element is relevant in this context.
Read my reply above, orders are being fulfilled, will be on time and within budget. As for bidding, there isn’t any bidding for contracts as there is only one single UK supplier, just like the H Bombs you don’t cut corners 🥴
It’s a good job GMB only accounts for about 5% of the workforce on the submarines site. Other unions have accepted a fair offer along with the rest of the workforce
Unions, same old, same old. Expect more of the same when Labour gets elected.
You could say the same about British management but given what is left of our manufacturing tends to be high quality and world class, I think the stereotyping needs to be put to one side.
They need to get around a table and talk because there is a huge prize not only for RR but the U.K. as a whole.
Increasing the numbers of highly trained U.K. engineers and exporting precision equipment is the holy grail to enhancing the GDP per capita of the country.
We have for too long allowed politicians to talk only about GDP, which you can grow by just increasing the size of the population with cheap foreign labour.
They have tried this method for over 20 years and we are now poorer in real terms than before.
Sorry rant over.
Good point, and geopolitical related too.
If the Pandemic showed one thing, it was that sovereign capabilities are required to be a sovereign nation in practice, IMHO.
Not pricing for risk has allowed key capabilities to be sent offshore by the follow the cash brigade.
A serious mistake, for example, sending manufacturing to CCP.
The only vote we have with the CCP dictatorship is not to buy their supposedly cheap products which in reality is an exchange of sovereign capabilities and so a loss of freedom.
A very bad bargain and something not priced into the deal at all, which allows the globalist to trade away our freedom without any accounting of that.
Don’t compare the RR Submarine Engineers here in Derby to same old, same old Union crap. I used to be a member of GMB and industrial action just never happened.
It was to use the correct ER term a very good example of the “Unitary” theory of ER.
Sit down talk through the problem, and sort it out because it’s in everyone interests to do so. It worked so well that now and then the Union sorted out issues before management knew they could be a problem.
What you do not do is offer a % pay rise to highly skilled Engineers and Reactor Designers 2% less than the Van driver working for the firm that delivers parts between sites.
And you sure has hell don’t do it when HMG has just signed the AUKUS agreement with the US and Australia, which means £400 million in investment, doubling the size of the site and the workforce.
FYI Officially the biggest single threat to AUKUS being a success is a skills shortage at RR Submarines and BAe up at Barrow.
I think it more down to British Management Same Old, Same Old 🤔
Top level managers are making £m’s in bonus’s every year. The people who produce deserve some of that reward as well.
No mention that all of the other unions have accepted the very good offer and the GMB have not put the offer to a vote.
Rolls Royce Management need to employ more workers to make up for the lost production caused by GMB union’s ignorance of the company’s financial position. Rolls Royce still has very high debt, doesn’t pay dividends yet and needs to prioritise paying down the debt in the current high interest rate environment. Rolls Royce workers are lucky to have such good jobs. Why are UK unions so Marxist ?