UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace has hosted Turkish Defence Minister Hulusi Akar on board HMS Prince of Wales.

The Ministry of Defence say that Minister Akar is on a two-day visit to the UK “to reaffirm our two countries’ close cooperation on defence and security as NATO Allies”.

According to a statement:

“Minister Akar was welcomed to the UK with a Guard of Honour from the Coldstream Guards at Horse Guards Parade, ahead of a bilateral meeting at the Ministry of Defence. Both defence ministers took the opportunity to discuss how the UK and Turkey could work together and with international partners to support regional security and the ongoing fight against Daesh terrorists – both nations are members of the Global Coalition to defeat Daesh.”

Defence Secretary Ben Wallace said:

“Turkey is an important NATO Ally and partner for the UK in upholding security in the Mediterranean and Black Sea regions.

I was delighted to welcome Minister Akar to the UK for fruitful discussions on how our nations can build on our strong defence relationship in a range of areas – from NATO exercises and operations to industry co-operation.”

The Ministry of Defence say in a news release about the visit that the Defence Secretary was able to showcase the “significant maritime capabilities” the UK can offer towards upholding international security aboard HMS Prince of Wales, docked at Her Majesty’s Naval Base Portsmouth.

On board the aircraft carrier, Mr Wallace and Mr Akar took part in a meeting with representatives from the British defence industry.

Subscribe
Notify of
guest
131 Comments
oldest
newest
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Sean
Sean
6 months ago

That seems a bit of a gaffe, reminding the Turks we have F35B equipped carriers whereas they’ve been thrown out of the F35 programme and will have nothing to fly off their carriers.

Johan
Johan
6 months ago
Reply to  Sean

Biden will let them back in, he is a idiot after all… and just wants to undo anything Trump signed or did. will turn USA into a 3rd world country

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  Johan

he’s not that bad. he’s not a racist cunt like trump.

Sceptical Richard
Sceptical Richard
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Hear, hear!

David
David
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Nate_m please, I don’t want you banned from the site! Language. Johan is a troll, just ignore him.

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  David

sorry.

Airborne
Airborne
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

He’s a buffoon but I don’t believe he’s actively racist, he’s arrogant with a sense of self importance, but not overtly racist. His policies were more to do with gaining votes, and he will do whatever it takes to whatever audience, to get them. Like any politician will do either side of the pond. And throwing about the term racist is easy to say, harder to prove. It’s an overused term, as once thrown into the debate scares people into submission.

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Airborne

Is he racist? According to his niece he is a narcissist that will do almost anything to get his own way. Many noted the freedom granted to white protesters whilst BLM supporters were given the stick. I would argue that if you pursue policies that have a racist element to them then you probably are a racist!

Airborne
Airborne
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

Or smart enough to use peoples fears and prejudice for his own gain. Continuous use of the term racist is both lazy and used to prevent the accused arguing against the accusation. The more it is overused reduces the impact when needed for overt and real racist agendas and abuse.

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Airborne

I take your point…but racism is a form of tribalism and is therefore a natural feature of the human condition. It follows that it is ubiquitous! May as well call it what it is!

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Airborne

Hear hear.

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Yawn, usual anti-Trump rhetoric. Lets call him names because we didn’t vote for him.

Biden is the true extremist, like most of the progressive left. He’s already started with the political interference in the military

Tucker Carlson: US military has gone full woke, waging war on those who disagree with them | Fox News

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

So funny…madness breaks out in the US military…from Fox News…what utter far right guff!

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

And so anything YOU don’t agree with is “Far right”, that must make you “far-Left”

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

Complete tosh…that isn’t a logical argument. Fox news has a very right-wing agenda….some of which is reminiscent of extreme right activists. You don’t have to be bloody Karl Marx to work that one out! I fervently hope that the UK doesn’t go down the route of heavy political bias as far as TV and radio are concerned!

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

My argument is as logical as anything you say. You disagree with Fox News, so they’re far right. You disagree with Trump so he’s a racist, or a fascist or whatever is the trigger word for the day.

You must be a communist then, comrade.

Biden is. Wonder what his mini-me boy has been up to …

Hunter Biden: What was he doing in China and Ukraine? – BBC News

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

I’ll try it one more time. Fox news advocates a far right platform…that is why I disagree with them. I really don’t think that you have the intellect to understand anything other than simple ‘yes it is..no it isn’t’….

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

Cannot argue with actual facts, so just call the opposition names.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

Anything to the right of Neil McKinnock is far right then, is that it? Got it.

Something different
Something different
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

Citing Fox News to support your claims doesn’t provide the most amount of credibility this side of the pond. Regardless of what is in his heart, Trump at the very least said things that could be construed as racially charged and seemed to be dog whistle statements to his base.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Trump has been gone for over two months. Think you could get over it now and post something relevant to defense or the military or almost anything else?

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  Johan

and it so happens that i don’t like racist cunts.

Steve Diggle
Steve Diggle
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

If your information comes from the main stream media, everything you think you know about Trump, Biden and many other things is incorrecr.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

I think there’s rain forecast. More tea vicar?

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

why of course 2 sugars and a milk.

HAHA! 😂😂😂😂😂

AlexS
AlexS
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

You seem to be one. After all Democratic party is nothing if it not exists.

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  AlexS

please state one thing that i said that was racist

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Hmm, “racist cunts” for starters.

John Hampson
John Hampson
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

I suppose for people like you there is no room to deviate from the party line. Irrelevant that African-American unemployement sank 5.5%, its lowest recorded level in history. Irrelevant that in 2019, the latest data available, the African-American poverty rate was 18.8% – which is the lowest on record, beating the previous year, since the official count began in the 1960s. Irrelevant that Trump increased federal funding for historically Black colleges and universities by 17 percent to a total exceeding $100 million — more than any president in history.( Obama, actually reduce this funding.) Irrelevant that under Trump, the Purchasing Power… Read more »

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  John Hampson

So anyone that despises Trump is a Democrat. As I understand it there are plenty of Republicans that detest the man. He was completely unfit for office…..but of course that is irrelevant for people like you!

John Hampson
John Hampson
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

I said absolutely nothing like that. I made absolutely no partisan Political comment. Maybe you should actually read posts before making condescending uninformed grunts. I said that the FACTS demonstrated that the living standards of African-Americans improved considerably due directly to Trump’s policies. The implementation of these policies fails to support the trite accusation that Trump acted in a racist manner. But these FACTS are utterly ignored by many as the FACTS do not support preconceptions. If he was “completely unfit for office” and he was directly responsible for some of the biggest improvements in living standards since records began,… Read more »

Meirion X
Meirion X
6 months ago
Reply to  John Hampson

It was Covid19 that punctured the economic balloon, inflated by tax cuts for the wealthly! T’s handling of the pandemic got off on a bad start, by saying ‘it’s a hoax’!

Last edited 6 months ago by Meirion X
John Hampson
John Hampson
6 months ago
Reply to  Meirion X

I agree with most of that but there are respected opinions that do not agree with the Left’s condemnation of Trumps tax cuts. Foe Example Bloomberg concluded, ” Vice President Joe Biden’s campaign website says, “Tax experts estimate that over the long run, 83% of Trump’s tax giveaway will flow to the top 1% of earners in this country.” That’s not quite fair to the president, though. While the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 was far from perfect, it did cut taxes on the middle class and fueled the economic growth that brought unemployment rates to half-century lows before… Read more »

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Meirion X

He never said that. You might also look at what Dr. Fauci said about the pandemic, masks, etc. back in March of 2020.” You can wear mask if it makes you feel better.” Among other things.

Last edited 6 months ago by David Flandry
John Clark
John Clark
6 months ago
Reply to  John Hampson

And yet John, you simply can’t get away from the fact that Trump utterly disgraced and insulted the most important high office in the world.

He’s quite simply an odious individual, with zero respect for anyone who doesn’t share his strange blinkered view of the world, or would you say otherwise? Genuinely interested….

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  John Hampson

okay. what about him asking his followers to attack the CAPITAL!!!!!! thats like someone asking someone else to blow the houses of parliament!

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Hardly an “attack” … a protest where the police stepped aside to let them into the capitol thereby allowing a small number of extremists

Given the artillery that a lot of the protestors were carrying its amazing there wasn’t a gun battle during their coup attempt, its almost as if they weren’t actually planning to attack and overthrow the government. Imagine that.

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

Keep taking the idiot pills Douglas. You don’t have the same doctor as Donald do you?

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

Yup – first one guy uses the C word, the now you are calling people idiots. That what I like about you progressive liberals, you are neither progressive or liberal.

Name calling is all you guys have.

Meirion X
Meirion X
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

There was certainly a lack of police to prevent elements of a crowd of 20000 trump supporters to push past the police and forced their way into the Capitol, on that day.

It was a attack by a determined element of the crowd of 20000 trump supporters!

Airborne
Airborne
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

That’s not racist, he didn’t use the term attack, he simply used his followers fears and narrative for his own end. With all due respect as you mature , tegzrdles if you agree or disagree, you will realise that’s politics. No matter what party, left, right, communist, liberal, facsist it’s all pretty much cheeks of the same arse. Sad, but true.

Airborne
Airborne
6 months ago
Reply to  Airborne

Tegzrdles…..is that a dinosaur! Auto correct, small I phone, big fingers, should say regardless.

Nate m
Nate m
6 months ago
Reply to  Airborne

excatly he know that dumb americans would take it this way but he still told them to do it despite the fact

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  John Hampson

Don’t give them facts! They don’t like facts,

Robert Blay.
Robert Blay.
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

I don’t want to see language like that on this site. I can swear with the best of them, but I draw the line at the C word. And certainly not on a defence website. Keep it for Facebook.

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

Nate obviously hit the Friday Night wine early.

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

Well Douglas, at least he has an excuse then for his stupid comments!

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

What’s yours then?

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

I’m old and half senile…..which is infinitely preferable to someone who, living in a moral vacuum, thinks that Trump is a marvellous fellow. Lack of judgement to that extent is more than ignorance, it’s a personality disorder!

Douglas Newell
Douglas Newell
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

You’re making an awful lot of assumptions about, I never said Trump was marvellous, I never said I’m a supporter. What I AM, is: not keen on the current so called liberal mindset of calling people racists, fascists and far-right just because they disagree with you politically. just because they disagree with your politics either. It’s like being back in the 1980’s with Rik from the Young Ones, it was ludicrous then, and its still ludicrous now. And I’m not too keen on calling people c**nts (which I know was someone else, but which started the debate) As for your… Read more »

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Douglas Newell

There you go…I am not a Biden supporter as such, I just think that he is infinitely better for the planet than Donald Trump. But not to worry as I am sure that Sir Kier will live up to your expectations in the next election!

Last edited 6 months ago by Herodotus
David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

You don’t have to think he is a marvelous fellow, any more than you need to think he is the Apotheosis of Evil.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  Nate m

You should be banned from this site until you at least can speak in standard English without infantile profanity,

Meirion X
Meirion X
6 months ago
Reply to  Johan

Biden has Not undone anything on foreign policy, China sanctions stay in place etc.
Turkey would only be let back in, if they comply with US policy in the region!

Last edited 6 months ago by Meirion X
Something different
Something different
6 months ago
Reply to  Johan

A bit of a hyperbolic statement surely? I think it’s in the UK’s national interest to have a bit of stability in Washington. As for the question in hand the selling of F35s to Turkey really should depend if they play ball regarding Russia.

Supportive Bloke
Supportive Bloke
6 months ago

The sheer size of it sends enough of a message: oh and the fact we have F35B and they ummm don’t.

Stand Off Rocket Man
Stand Off Rocket Man
6 months ago

Turkey has got to be kept on our side as it’s strong and willing to fight.
We’ve got to increase cooperation with ‘her’ and keep her sweet, ie not to take umbrage only to see her come under the influence of Russia. What about buying some of their drones? Politically untenable?

Lordtemplar
Lordtemplar
6 months ago

Our side? Erdogan is a facist islamist.

Stand Off Rocket Man
Stand Off Rocket Man
6 months ago
Reply to  Lordtemplar

And? We sell arms to plenty of Middle Eastern countries and don’t think twice about it.

Spyinthesky
Spyinthesky
6 months ago

Both can be true they could be a bigger threat than Russia in a decade who knows things with both are very unpredictable, but yes presently we have to bite the bullet see bigger pictures and keep them onside and hope they get a more civilised leadership, or at least reduce the likelihood of driving them into the Russian/Chinese camp. One thing we don’t want to do however Is think they are a friendly power and arm them in ways that come back to bite in ways that most Middle Eastern countries are not likely to do for varying reasons.… Read more »

Stand Off Rocket Man
Stand Off Rocket Man
6 months ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

Yeah, this is pretty much my view.

David
David
6 months ago
Reply to  Spyinthesky

I thought the Turks were in for a carrier… good sales op, just de spec the electronics; leave it up to them to get the right planes and let the Generals decide which side their Yufka is buttered.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  David

Turkey is going to build an aircraft carrier, probably two. The Turkish Navy is larger than the British or French, and has a long tradition

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  Lordtemplar

All roads lead to Constantinople 🙂

Johan
Johan
6 months ago

WTF they steal all the architectural rights to what ever they buy, and then reverse engineer them, its like a modern 70s russia

Stand Off Rocket Man
Stand Off Rocket Man
6 months ago
Reply to  Johan

Maybe we should do the same with Russia’s hypersonic missiles? I means teal the plans and then just copy the design and put a big Union Jack on it. That’s if their missiles are everything they are made out to be.

Last edited 6 months ago by Stand Off Rocket Man
Palaboran
Palaboran
6 months ago

First you’ve got to catch one.

Stand Off Rocket Man
Stand Off Rocket Man
6 months ago
Reply to  Palaboran

Or steal the plans.

AJP1960
6 months ago

Erdogan is already buying Russian equipment and has heavyweight financial debt to China. Turkey should be kicked out of NATO, not cosied up to

David
David
6 months ago
Reply to  AJP1960

When you mention heavyweight financial debt, balance of trade deficit, do any other countries come to mind that should be kicked out of NATO…

…certainly NOT Germany for example.

Cameron
Cameron
6 months ago
Reply to  AJP1960

China (government, banks, companies and individuals) owns more than $1.1 Trillion of US debt. If you want Turkey to leave NATO due to it’s debt to China, how do all the other NATO member fare…?

Levi Goldsteinberg
Levi Goldsteinberg
6 months ago

I find it an odd juxtaposition that while the French and pals are at the Turk’s throat, we seem to be closer to them than ever before. I should add we just signed an FTA with them as well. Not only that, but we also lent them drilling ships while France was desperately trying to look tough and stop the Turks drilling in the Eastern Med

farouk
farouk
6 months ago

levi wrote:

Not only that, but we also lent them drilling ships 

Actually we haven’t, the Turks purchased a drilling ship which was built in South Korea for a Brazilian company in 2012, the company went bankrupt and it was seized March 2019 for unpaid debts. It was moored off Port Talbot in Wales until it came up for auction, where it was sold off cheap in which to recuperate some of those debts.

Levi Goldsteinberg
Levi Goldsteinberg
6 months ago
Reply to  farouk

I see. I think you’ve actually explained this to me before but I forgot – apologies

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  farouk

They got them from Norway but next drilling ships will be made in Turkey . Turkey has a large shipping industry that produce civilian cargo container ships , cruise liners , yachts , corvettes, frigates submarines and soon destroyers

Last edited 6 months ago by James
Joe16
Joe16
6 months ago

Little bit of “look at our cool carrier and big bearskin hats! BTW, could we have some of those fancy budget drones and EW systems you’ve been kicking arse with recently?”

Supportive Bloke
Supportive Bloke
6 months ago
Reply to  Joe16

Our drone capability will be soon put theirs in the shade.

There was little point in deploying immature systems that are no use in near peer.

The budget drones would not survive for 5 minutes in an environment with naval CIWS and point missile systems.

Spyinthesky
Spyinthesky
6 months ago

Yeah their drones were pretty much designed on the quick when they were refused higher tech ones from abroad. If we can’t at least match that then we truly are wasting our time. I think the direction they went in is probably somewhat similar to the old Fairey Swordfish where a very low tech but surprisingly competent platform completely caught out an u prepared defence. That however while massively a wake up call doesn’t mean the very same tech would be equally useful for us or for any length of time. As Steve Jobs always highlighted while learning from what… Read more »

AlexS
AlexS
6 months ago

“The budget drones would not survive for 5 minutes in an environment with naval CIWS and point missile systems.”

Tell me what CIWS have ceiling to down a BKT 2 drone? I can only think of Oto 76mm.

Paul T
Paul T
6 months ago

The Drones Turkey Designed and Built have been proved in Combat in near – peer and peer Operations.

Pete
Pete
6 months ago

Agree with Alex S and would add that swarm cheap drones would quickly exhaust point defence Missiles systems. Got to hand it to the Turks. Early utilisation of innovations, gain an advantage, learn from operational use and continue evolving based on real world use rather than a decade or so of research and development trials with concepts eventually shelved while we visualise a new horizon to walk towards.

Matt
Matt
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

Afternoon Paul.
“For the procurement of 4 new frigates, plus an interim solution”…
Perhaps they will purchase our 2 outgoing Type 23s as the “interim solution”?
[email protected]

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  Matt

Sounds like a reasonable assumption. I’d like to see that.

BB85
BB85
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

I thought Greece was purchasing those very expensive French Beharah Frigates or whatever they are called. Arrowhead would certainly be much more affordable but they will be built in Greece so not sure how the UK would benefit. The sub systems are more likely to be Danish.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  BB85
James H
James H
6 months ago

Is there anyone that we dont mind turning a blind eye to? Moment someone wants to do some trade with us they become our best friend.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  James H

London is awash with Arab and Russian money. Cameron’s plan was that China would rescue our economy if we left the EU and finance our new nuclear power stations and high speed rail. Now we have a moral conscience about the Uighurs and China is considered a threat. They are too powerful – we cannot control them. So our latest hope for economic salvation is a trade deal with India- more malleable. Asia-Pacific has now morphed into Indo-Pacific. No mention of course of the Modis ambition to turn India into a single religion Hindu state – discrimination against Christians and… Read more »

Sean
Sean
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

Ridiculous conjecture.
The U.K. doesn’t need any “economic salvation” anymore than any other G7 nation. In fact, the U.K. is economically in a better position than other members. But I suspect these facts doesn’t suit your anti-Boris prejudice. 🤷‍♂️

John Clark
John Clark
6 months ago
Reply to  Sean

Some folks just love to bash Boris…. Simple fact is, he’s led the country from the front, through the most difficult period since the darkest days of 1940. He’s made mistakes, any leader would. Thank the gods we didn’t have a bungling Labour government that couldn’t organise a piss up in a brewery….. To illustrate the point, Labour has sensibly ditched it’s looney tunes left wing elements and sent them scuttling back to the shadows. Despite this panicking course correction to the middle ground and electing an ‘apparently’ electorally safe, over cautious grey lawyer type as leader, (who seems terrified… Read more »

Last edited 6 months ago by John Clark
Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  John Clark

In many ways you could say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. We see a Tory government creating a generous furlough scheme, renationalising major rail services, rebuilding the armed forces and the shipbuilding industry, recruiting nurses and making concessions to sensible opposition proposals for emergency covid measures. Bellicose Corbyn and his acolytes have been replaced by a more courteous and constructive opposition front bench. Meanwhile Sturgeon, the UVF and the EU are doing their best to sink the ship. I for one am happy to see people of good will co-operating across the parties in the crisis.

John Clark
John Clark
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

Well said Paul, I do wish Labour would find its feet, because every government requires a good opposition to keep them on there toes.

The problem is, they need to play a ‘Blair’ type card (as much as I detested that man), for a true sea change and they already played it……

I’m beginning to think Labour is an utterly spent force to be honest.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  John Clark

Not a spent force but a more contrite and mature force who are learning to work by influencing and rational argument rather than yelling. As I see it we have a constructive opposition assuming a supporting role in what is a de-facto government of national unity lead by one nation tories. Given Brexit, Covid, the passing of Prince Phillip, Ms Sturgeon and riots in Belfast that’s absolutely appropriate. Strikers don’t score without an assist.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  Sean

I’ve no problem with Boris. He is doing a good job. as the saying goes the Lord loves a repentant sinner. I agree with JC’s comments below; he leads a team which has neutralised the labour party by adopting social democratic policies, albeit the covid crisis forced the issue of people before profit.
My ‘economic salvation’ comment was sarcastic. Sorry you didn’t appreciate that. Have a nice day. 🙂

James H
James H
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

I do agree with you, but reading the comments i so dislike how people dislike others having an opinion different to them now.
Since the economic crisis in 2008 we have tried to get investment from outside which has led to a situation with china where we are constantly at odds with ourselves but that is similar to Australia’s position.
I just wish our moral compass wasn’t so swayed by money

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  James H

The problem is if you are only prepared to deal with people who agree with your ‘moral compass’ you wouldn’t trade with anyone. The trick is to avoid being tempted to lower your own standards so you can keep a clear conscience. I used to have a German accountant colleague who explained to me that in Germany bribing a German company was a crime but bribing an export customer was tax deductable. I do sense a sea change government attitude away from the Cameron strategy of **se licking potential external investors towards standing on our own two feet and having… Read more »

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

Not to point out the very obvious when we left the EU we have continued to trade with them, not exactly 100% as was but the ‘Cliff edge’ and all that other crap has not happened.

I one for am glad that we have shown an ethical stance towards China as should the rest of the world but the EU for one rushed a trade deal through with them as quickly as they could.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  James

Well, mindful of DFs reprimand re political discussions 😊 I will only say that in EU defence matters we should continue to work with French, take a lead role in securing the North Atlantic and do our share in defending NATO and Europe’s eastern borders against Russian aggression. All these assignments are reflected in the defence review.

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

Undoubtedly the French are key to securing the area, we both need each other vastly until Germany starts to pull its weight properly.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago
Reply to  James

Germany pulling it weight properly? I wish, but will never happen. People still react to what took place over 76 years ago.

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  David Flandry

They have certainly gone in the right direction, injecting more cash and ordering/fixing assets, if its just a small move to divert attention from them who knows lets see.

JohnG
JohnG
6 months ago

Some countries do respect simple brute force. I wonder if anything tangible will come of this meeting or what both countries long term goals are. Perhaps turkey needs western allies in response to their bellicose behaviour towards the USA, France, Germany and Greece. I sorely hope we are sharp enough to be able to trade this for some cold hard benefit to our country, although based on past evidence I imagine there will be some wishy washy benefit to no one in particular, perhaps save to Turkey. Turkey always interests me and I think will be a country to watch… Read more »

Dave Wolfy
Dave Wolfy
6 months ago

We are in a double act with the US, we are the nice guys.
The US does the dirty to keep people like the Greeks onside, we keep the contact.

OOA
OOA
6 months ago

That’s POW up for sale then.

Mr Bell
Mr Bell
6 months ago
Reply to  OOA

I dont think so. But I do think Turkey wants to operate a larger class of carrier than an lphd. They might sign a contract for the QE design and equipment to be built in Turkey. Not sure why we would go along with that but as BoJo is in charge, who the hell knows what will happen?

Sean
Sean
6 months ago
Reply to  Mr Bell

That would be a “carrier with no aircraft”…

Sean
Sean
6 months ago
Reply to  OOA

Ridiculous comment.

OOA
OOA
6 months ago
Reply to  Sean

i sincerely hope you’re right.

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  OOA

Turkey is developing unmanned fighter jets plus a 5th generation fighter jet . I think most on here know very little about global defence or Turkish defence and focus on the UK only or US at times .

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  James

Russia are also developing such things oh and Iran too but they funnily enough very rarely see the light of day. Turkey is a growing power but its not at the forefront of technology yet, the only country in the region that has such abilities is Israel and Turkey are a long way behind them.

Andrew D
Andrew D
6 months ago

Please don’t say were thinking of selling one of our carriers, if the Turks get to buy f35s now Biden is in power.

Paul42
Paul42
6 months ago
Reply to  Andrew D

Turkey is interested in acquiring a carrier along similar lines to QE by building one, not buying one of ours.

Meirion X
Meirion X
6 months ago
Reply to  Andrew D

Erdogan is far from Biden’s liking! Very unlikly US would sell F-35’s to Turkey again. Also if the UK sold IP plans for Turkey to build a QE type carrier it would really unset the balance of power in the East Med. BoJo will receive a visiter soon asking him not to do so, in return for something, more likely!

Last edited 6 months ago by Meirion X
Sean
Sean
6 months ago
Reply to  Andrew D

Are we to go through this nonsense every-time a foreign dignitary gets a tour of one of the carriers? 🤦‍♂️

Herodotus
Herodotus
6 months ago
Reply to  Sean

I understand that Putin would like a look around it!

Andrew D
Andrew D
6 months ago
Reply to  Herodotus

With out a doubt ,Tony Blair would of let Putin borrow it.

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  Andrew D

Surprised Blair didnt set up Hertz rental for anything we had in the fleet, mates rates discounts providing he got paid to an account in Panama.

TrevorH
TrevorH
6 months ago

It’s up to the EU to let them in now if they want. We are out of the EU so can avoid the consequences.

Turkey was important to NATO, but it’s all a bit ambivalent now with it being more fundamentalists and effectively totalitarian.

Supportive Bloke
Supportive Bloke
6 months ago
Reply to  TrevorH

EU + Turkey would not suite France and Club Med.

Turkey are not interested in creating a socialist feather bed where as long as everyone is as inefficient as it each other that is fine.

Tony Blur was largely responsible for starting on boarding Turkey and then nobody afterwards was that interested.

James
James
6 months ago

I’m always impressed by the Turkey bashing on here when it was Turkey a year ago sending aid to the UK with PPE kits and ventilators when others were not selling any to the UK let alone donate , including the US and Israel. Which other country pokes Russia like Turkey in the entire west and gets on their face in Syria Libya Azerbaijan? None ! Turkish military equipment has proven itself to take out Russian air defence, Chinese drones in battle. And now are building next generation of drones. Turkey has build its own corvettes and now frigates and… Read more »

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  James

Erdogen sees himself as rebuilding the Islamic Ottoman empire which lasted a thousand years and only ended in 1922. The list of countries which were part of the empire bears an uncanny resemblance to the countries currently feeling the influence of Turkish military force.
https://www.history.com/topics/middle-east/ottoman-empire

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  Paul.P

That’s nonsense , countries that share values and history have every right to build their own block that looks after its interest in this emerging multipolar world that includes the middle East that suffered a lot the past century and Africa too. They want their own voices heard. The EU has its block the UK wants the Commonwealth and some may accuse it of imperial dreams with their ” Global Britain ” ambition. China is being accused of trying to build an empire and Russia is dreaming of restarting a Soviet Union again haha And uncle Sam is wondering what… Read more »

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  James

The uk isnt going around invading territories as part of Global Britain though is it? Turkey is very much following Russia’s way of thinking by grabbing land in Syria and meddling in Libya. Its also following Chinas way of thinking with territories in the med and causing many tensions with Greece. All the while holding the EU to ransom for money in exchange for migrants, great country to be a rising power in the region. Fully appreciate in some ways Erdogan has stood up to Putin on a few occasions and then appears to work with him the following week,… Read more »

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  James

Maybe your clock starts with brexit , but the last I remember we invaded Iraq and destroyed Libya which ended in the death of millions, and the cost of that war is still being repaid by the treasury. Turkey was not the one that bombed Syria and caused the civil war there nor did it destroy Libya . It’s supporting in Libya the UN recognised government against a warlord backed by France who did war crimes . Syria like Libya was a stable country until it was destroyed by Europeans and the US. Turkey was not getting 1 refugee from… Read more »

Last edited 6 months ago by James
James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  James

One big flaw in the argument you have, the government the UK has now is not the government that invaded Iraq (by the hands of the USA) or the one that meddled stupidly in Libya (again at the hands of the USA). Both the US and UK governments have changed, something that is no longer allowed to happen in Turkey since Erdogan installed himself as a dictator. Turkey acting as a peacekeeper? You are having a laugh surely. Its movement into Syria as a ‘buffer zone’ is just propaganda its a blatant land grab, it would have went further if… Read more »

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago

If you are going to allow these comments to degenerate into base political conversations, at least have the sense to rename the site.

Paul.P
Paul.P
6 months ago
Reply to  David Flandry

Point taken . Although it has to said that the use of military force is usually rooted in economic and political considerations which in their turn are influenced by history and cultural memory.

Something different
Something different
6 months ago
Reply to  David Flandry

War is the continuation of politics by other means

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago

Of course that is true. Nota bene: I did say base political conversations. No problem with politics per se,

James
James
6 months ago
Reply to  David Flandry

Some on here once other countries are mentioned get emotional biased unfortunately and use no logic , and the worst part is they are historically inaccurate.

David Flandry
David Flandry
6 months ago

As long as you are going to allow political comments on a military website, I’m going to put in my two hundred pounds worth.