The Royal Navy is deploying HMS Dragon to the Middle East, where the Type 45 destroyer will pre-position ahead of a potential multinational mission to protect international shipping in the Strait of Hormuz, the UK Defence Journal understands.
A Ministry of Defence spokesman confirmed the deployment. “We can confirm that HMS Dragon will deploy to the Middle East to pre-position ahead of any future multinational mission to protect international shipping when conditions allow them to transit the Strait of Hormuz. The pre-positioning of HMS Dragon is part of prudent planning that will ensure that the UK is ready, as part of a multinational coalition jointly led by the UK and France, to secure the strait, when conditions allow.”
The destroyer is being repositioned from the eastern Mediterranean, where it had been defending British bases on Cyprus. Moving Dragon to the region now would allow the ship to contribute immediately should the defensive mission be launched. The MoD has described the proposed operation as “strictly defensive and independent.”
HMS Dragon is the fourth of the Royal Navy’s six Type 45 air defence destroyers, launched in November 2008 and commissioned on 20 April 2012. The class was designed primarily for area air defence and displaces around 8,000 tonnes, with a length of 152.4 metres and a top speed in excess of 30 knots. The ships are powered by an integrated electric propulsion system drawing on two Rolls-Royce WR-21 gas turbines and two Wärtsilä diesel generators, giving a range in excess of 7,000 nautical miles at 18 knots.
Dragon’s primary air defence capability is provided by the Principal Anti-Air Missile System, which draws on 48 Sylver vertical launch cells capable of firing both Aster 15 and Aster 30 missiles, covering targets at ranges from under two kilometres to in excess of 100 kilometres.
The ship is also equipped with the SAMPSON multi-function radar and the S1850M long-range air surveillance radar, giving it one of the most capable air picture compilation and engagement systems in the Royal Navy’s surface fleet. For close-in defence, Dragon carries two 20mm Phalanx close-in weapon systems alongside a 4.5-inch Mark 8 naval gun and two DS30B 30mm cannons.
The ship can operate one or two Wildcat helicopters armed with Martlet multirole missiles or Sea Venom anti-ship missiles, the latter of which reached initial operating capability in October 2025. Alternatively, Dragon can embark a Merlin helicopter for anti-submarine operations. The ship carries a complement of 191, with accommodation for up to 235.
“Multi-National”:- e.g. UK + USA?
well no, French carrier group is already heading there having crossed the Suez two days ago
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No, USA not invited, she will be going in with the CDG strike group and covering the Bay class doing MCM
Amazing comments chaps.
Did anyone actually read what the article said ?
Just asking as It seems that most missed the critical bit where It sad HMS Dragon will be “Pre Positioned” and ready to be used “When Conditions Allow”.
Basically, She is not going there to fight, nor Is the French Navy. They are being “Pre Positioned” ready for the “War” to end.
But It’s fun seeing all the answers.
I did. More political double speak. 🙃
Hello Geoff, exactly my point.
Unfortunately my comment was Intended as a general response but this site format placed It In a different section.
My comment does still stand though, reading most of the responses makes me feel that the actual Article words and those quoted from government sources, were just not considered.
Good job some of us are only Half Witted !!!!
Compared to some of the “brains” governing us I reckon we’re pretty good mate. 🤭
Seems to be standard operating procedure for many of the commentators here – look at the photo, maybe read the headline, then post a comment 🤦🏻♂️
No ships will go in until there is a peace arrangement. The mighty Americans escorted 2 commercial ships out, that’s all. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Trump has gifted Iran. Slightly loose talk from MoD.
I thought that was pretty obvious to anyone… but then there are quite a few idiots on here so maybe it’s worth stating 🤷🏻♂️
The USA has proven Iran already possesses a weapon of mass financial destruction more powerful than any nuke;- control of the Straits of Hormuz.
Yes.
Agreed.
Blimey.
I have to look at the photo first! Nobody told me.
Nothing wrong with looking at the photo – though many are stock images or AI generated. The problem is when people don’t do anything else before commenting…
Hw,
Ummm … er … there is also the possibility that some commentators are concerned re the dreaded “mission creep.” Wherein an escort mission eventually is transformed into regime change/nation building/Jeffersonian Democracy development. Essentially, ye olde “fool me once, shame in you”; “fool me twice, shame…’ 🤔
So how many ships will France be committing?
Much of their fleet I guess? Several transited the Suez Canal recently.
Or, was that a rigged question?
According to the Telegraph, she is now joining the Charles de Gaulle CBG. So France will be doing most of the heavy lifting with us sending only one ship. The RN truly is in a bad way!
Yes but then our carriers are in the north. Not saying it’s great but to be fair the RN is focusing on the north and Russia.
HMS Sutherland is doddering around following Russians around the channel area
HMS St Albans is doing the same but in our northern waters
HMS Portland is working up to join the UK CBG for this summers CBG based around Prince of wales
HMS Prince of wales is in the high north on exercise with NATO
HMS Queen Elizabeth is at see in Homs waters preparing for NATO exercises
HMS Duncan is with HMS prince of wales
That’s 6 major surface combatants at sea in the northern European area… the reality is someone had to stay home and mind the sheep.
Dash that rules our a fleet review again then. Should have had a coronation review but i’m guessing we dont do that stuff any more.
🤦🏻♂️
2 of them are carriers, both without panes . I believe POW is deploying with helicopters as we don’t have enough planes and 1 hull might be ready in the summer. The reality is 3 hulls and one of those is “the” escort for POW. Sadly lacking. And, to send 1 ship to the gulf we had to remove it from it’s duties of protecting Cyprus. I am guessing we were able to fill the gap with Army units. Yet when I say units, I probably mean unit.
Well Merlins are better than F35s for ASW work.🤷🏻♂️
Thanks for posting, very interesting
HMS QE is deploying? Can the RN really deploy the 2 carriers at once?
They are both out at the moment.
But isn’t QE simply training in UK waters as usual? I don’t think there’s enough crew to send it to any NATO exercice. You would also need escort.
Fereh.
Yes, QE RO8 is currently in a training cycle / post-refit sea trials, testing the upgrades made to her propulsion and stabilisation systems while in Rosyth. She will be reparing to join NATO’s Allied Response Force exercises later this year, which will see her lead a UK Carrier Strike Group.
“UK Carrier Strike Group” … what a giggle.
Analysts expect she will also require allied escorts to meet the ‘magic number’ of six protective vessels required for high-threat environments.
Which submarine is currently escorting PoW for Firecrest?
Are France or the US getting the job again?
Well that’s top-secret … ‘dontcha know’.
If a UK hunter-killer submarine (SSN) is attached to the Firecrest group, it would be one of the remaining Astute-class vessels. However, because of the limited availability of British hulls, it is highly probable that the undersea escort for this mission is being provided by an Allied partner, most likely a US Navy Virginia class or Los Angeles class submarine, or potentially a Norwegian one given the High North focus of the operation.
Most European allies like Germany, Norway, Netherlands operate diesel-electric – SSK submarines. These are incredibly quiet but struggle to keep pace with a carrier strike group moving at high speeds over long distances in the rough North Atlantic. A carrier like PoW moves fast, so to provide a constant shield, you ideally need a nuclear attack submarine – SSN.
Norwegian Ula-class submarines are absolute masters of the fjords. They are small, incredibly quiet, and know every underwater hiding hole in their coastline. In this specific environment; shallow, rocky, and complex, a massive nuclear sub like a British Astute or a US Virginia is actually at a disadvantage. The Norwegians provide the scout capability that the big ships lack in those waters. The carrier group is currently transitioning into Exercise Dynamic Mongoose; NATO’s premier anti-submarine warfare exercise.
The goal of Firecrest is to prove european cooperation, having a Norwegian sub integrated into the carrier’s defense screen is a huge political win, even if that sub only stays with the group while they are in the Northern waters.
Because Norwegian subs are diesel-electric, they can’t escort the carrier all the way across the Atlantic at 25 knots. However, for a mission like Firecrest, NATO uses a phase system
Phase 1 – North Sea/Fjords a Norwegian sub handles the close-in protection while the carrier is in the littorals.
Phase 2 – Deep Atlantic/High North, once the carrier hits the deep, open water of the Arctic, a US or British Nuclear sub SSNs with endurance take over the long-range watch.
So, since France is the only other European nation with SSNs, and their fleet is often busy in the Mediterranean or Indo-Pacific, a US Virginia-class boat is usually the only ‘spare’ nuclear sub available to join the group.
And that is the total of our surface fleet unfortunately. Now Iron Duke is out of action pending the official scrapping notice
Don’t worry HMS Victory has nearly completed her 200 year refit.
We operate a rotation with the French to have one carrier available at all time, it’s France’s turn now just like it was ours when the Red Sea was blocked.
don’t forget the Italian Navy as well, all 3 nations rotate carriers esp for a presence in the indo-pacific
She’ll be up Fareham Creek before this war stops If “Resident Chump” carries on like he has !
Would rather it stayed by Cypress (looking after British possessions) – although it is amusing to see the French acknowledging they they cheaped out on their AD radar.
I’m sure the data from the Huthi tests was shared via the A30 consortium and they will know that T45 is the leading AAW unit.
Hmm. Whilst SAMPSON is better, I don’t think EMPAR is significantly worse against the air threat they’ll be facing.
France could’ve sent the new FDI which has a more capable radar than both Horizon and T45 classes. But what Iran and the Houthis have is definitely not enough to get past EMPAR.
Lol. SeaFire is a decent system, but it’s not a SAMPSON, or even really not an EMPAR analogue. Especially when mounted on the FDI.
And I’m supposed to take your word for it?
Sea Fire is superior to SAMSPON, there’s a generational gap between the 2, even though SAMPSON remains very good.
Funny, considering you’re expecting me to take your word for it.
I already knew you’d say that. If you’re not bothering then why should I? It’s not that serious.
There may be a generational gap but basic physics still has some relevance and the architecture is similar – both are S-band AESA. Sea Fire has a higher output power. SAMPSON has a bigger aperture and is higher up.
From the limited amount of data in the public realm, the best we can conclude is that Sea Fire, as a system, offers near-SAMPSON levels of performance in a more modern and efficient package. Marketing material isn’t exactly the most reliable source of information, but if Thales is “only” claiming 800 tracked targets (vs 1000 for SAMPSON) out to 500km, its reasonable to conclude Sea Fire isn’t as capable as SAMPSON.
I really wouldn’t trust the SeaFire claims, especially given they are apparently advertising SPY-6 level performance out of a system half the size.
Both SPY-6 and Sea Fire are modern, Gallium Nitride-based S-band AESA radars, built to be scalable for ships from frigates to carriers.
We have no way of knowing for sure, but it would be logical to assume both Thales and Raytheon are giving figures for the maximum array size.
What back up will Dragon have to call on now that US. does not like us anymore?
In recent days 3 US destroyers were swarm attacked where the IRGC used a combination of anti-ship missiles, drones, and small fast attack craft.
At least one of the destroyers had a laser and used it on the drones They also had air cover from both F18s and Apache gunships.
I hope Dragon won’t be operating alone.
I assume dragon will being hanging around in the Arabian Sea well away from the littoral… waiting for whatever multinational force develops.
Dragon will be supporting French and other ships . It will be in safe hands .
It still has no NSMs or the Camms or Dragonfire. Whatever happened to at Pace I wonder?
Pace for a Labour Govt is implementing Operation Dynamo. I suspect they must have at least two Committees overseeing whether health and safety was properly maintained.
Just seen that a Catherine West has said she will challenge Starmer.
As feared 2 years ago whenever Labour are in power, here comes the far left.
Corbyn supporter, tick. Oh, and a member of the Fabian society to boot! That’ll please John….
Wonderful.
The biggest joke is that Gordon Brown has been brought in to sort out defence funding.
The ultimate off balance sheet, double announcement specialist….OMG just at the point I thought that it couldn’t get worse.
I’ve seen it all now.
SB.
OK, I didn’t know that was his remit, only that he’d been called in.
The same PM who couldn’t even appoint a full time DS, and to whom the real hero Johnson Beharry turned his back, after his supposed disrespect to the forces.
The same PM who panicked and had to
buy 6 Merlin diverted from Denmark as the RAF had so few assets.
The same PM who, I think it was, took the Voyager PFI costs off the books.
The same PM who cut billions off of the FABR budget ( future amphibious battlefield rotorcraft to the uninitiated ) which was to replace the 33 Sea King HC4s of the CHF.
Instead, Peter was robbed to pay Paul and RAF Merlins transferred to the RN.
On the plus side, he got the 2 Carriers built, no surprise given his constituency, but still delayed them by over a year at a cost of 1 billion. DS Hutton presided over that. I’ve had rows here with people telling me that was the Tories and it never happened, until I show the newspapers from 2009 reporting it.
Short memories, or selective ones.
I don’t know.. ..damned Tory cuts!!!
At least he intervened in the 2014 indy referendum, so for that at least, I’m grateful to him for.
…and the same PM who lefet the Tories with a £106 billion (2010 money) blackhole; sold off our gold reserves at a knock down price and precipitated the 2008 financial meltdown. All forgotten now of course.😏 Ideal man to look after global finance, whatever that means.
Don’t forget the “Bigoted woman” comment to the lady sick to the back teeth at the impact of mass immigration in her area.
Seems nothings changed, as several millions gave Labour a kicking a few days ago and they’re STILL not listening.
Why listen when you have such a good strong cabinet. Picking up your point below, people have forgotten or don’t want to remember, that most of the Labour party is left or far left. God save us from what might happen next.
He is to blame for many things, but not the 2008 financial crisis. That was caused by the subprime mortgage crisis in the USA, which acted as a catalyst to the sovereign debt crisis in Europe.
While his “saved the world” brag in the commons was over the top, the USA and other Western governments all adopted the UK’s approach of quantitative easing and bank bailouts to avoid a complete collapse of the western financial system.
The Fabian society.. god bless. Although I’m pretty sure they would enact a socialist republic and ban religion so maybe no “god bless” .
She’s not running, but that was never the idea.
The IDEA is to destabilise even more, forcing a leadership contest so one of her ilk take over. From the far left of the party.
I warned of this when Labour came to power.
And yes, I WILL say far left, as it seems fine for everybody to call Reform far right, which is utterly ridiculous, including the mainstream media.
What’s good for the goose.
Reform are the far right because there is nobody to the right of them.
I am not certain you can call the left wing of the Labour party the far left because there are two parties to the left of the Labour Party, the Greens and the ridiculous named ‘Your Party’.
Admittedly YP are the joke they deserve to be, but the Greens are now a major force.
To be honest I think the best be can hope for is a leadership change and then everyone agrees a compromise candidate in Alistair Carns.. it’s unlikely but just possible.
I believe Catherine West is a dual 🇦🇺 🇬🇧 . Not sure what came first but down here in Aus parliamentarians have to surrender their UK citizenship to serve. Is that not the case in the UK then?
Hope the UK gets a leader that knows how to lead, listen and serve, not some half baked pretenders.
*Australian born according to a news post here.
Boris J is USA born
The Scottish Greens have just had elected to the Scottish Parliament an MSP who isn’t a British National. He’s isn’t here on a work visa but on a student visa. He is now launched a gofundme to raise funds for this new visa. You couldn’t make it up.
There is no UK equivalent to Section 44 of the Australian Constitution, which famously disqualified many Australian MPs for holding dual citizenship. In the UK, dual citizens like Boris Johnson, who was a US-UK citizen for years, have successfully held high office without issue.
In Australia it’s not just Poms who have to surrender their dual citizenship –
Foreign Allegiance (Section 44(i)): Any person who is a citizen of, or owes allegiance to, a “foreign power” is ineligible. This famously includes dual citizens.
Particularly surprising your terror of them given that the Fabians are broadly to the right of the party and didn’t particularly support Corbyn.
Not sure why people are terrified given they have provided every single Labour PM ever. It’s like critiquing a Reform shadow cabinet member for being an ex-Tory, or a Tory PM for being in the Carlton Club. If you did that, there wouldn’t be any left… or right, I suppose.
Jonno,
Apologies for the repetition. Your comments did not appear until a refresh after submission. On the plus side, it’s obvious and comforting to reaffirm that certain minds think alike … 🤔😁👍😉
Lucky Iran has no navy then, her wildcats are however armed with two types of missiles tailor made for dealing with Iranian small boats and drones.
And hopefully some extra anti decoy tech has been added or test out the Dragonfire?
Talking of CAMM. There’s a huge unused space on top the T45s hangar. It might look a bit ugly and be a bit too weighty but could they squeeze in a 4×6 CAMM farm there?
How will that help to have ship killing capability against ad hoc speed boats jet skies hand held whatever?
BoF,
Exactly, perhaps await the availability of HMS Defender w/ Sea Ceptor mod? Additionally, Dragonfire, NSM, and reactivation of hull mounted Ultra sonar are all advised, as well as deploying the entire available stockpile of Martlet and Sea Venom. Persian Gulf/Stair of Hormuz will remain an active theater for the foreseeable future, courtesy of IRGC. HMG/MoD/RN should carefully conduct and evaluate a cost/benefit analysis of placing a virtually irreplaceable naval asset in significant harm’s way. Random thoughts from one of the now-hated colonials … 🤔
… Strait of Hormuz…🙄
When everyone goes nuts at just one warship.. is worth remembering who has the greatest presence in Northern European waters and who’s guarding the sheep from Russian rustlers.
The RN has 5 major surface combatants at sea in Northern European waters and one just working up.. 2 carriers, 2 T23s, 1 T23 just about to join the CBG this summer and a T45.
Yes it is way lower than it should be and the fact is the RN should have adequate forces in norther European waters, have major surface combatant patrols in the south Atlantic and east of suez as well as be able to provide a task group for an issue like this… that’s why it was meant to have 30-32 escorts in peace time.. so it had 10+ deployments to play with.
Agree the base level of RN numbers is not rocket science . When one recognises outside of Home and northern Nato duties . The uk has treaties and obligations off top of my head in South Atlantic ; Antarctic , the Mediteranian , the Gulf area , indian ocean , the Pacific and the West Indies . Im sure i have forgotten some where but that 7 vast regions that ideally all require a prsence of somekind. The rule of 3s would be at least 15 frigates just for international duties not including home and north atlantic as a guide. But at present rate even 10yrs time i dont think we will have 15 frig destroyers for all duties including home waters and north atlantic .
Johnathan It did rather seem like by the end of that contribution you were rapidly becoming more sympathetic as to why ‘everyone is going nuts’ at there being only one ship available. As we have just lost Iron Duke let’s hope we don’t lose any more frigates, what is it 5 left now? If we get 3 out of 5 at sea at one time that will actually be quite impressive but one wonders how long that can be maintained as they are falling like flies presently despite recent major refits and still some time before replacements become operational. Thankfully considering their horrendous losses Russia will soon be struggling to recruit sheep rustlers so we are probably safe for a while yet for our Sunday Roasts.
HMS QE is on sea trials for several months so I think counting her is a bit of a stretch. What’s more neither of them have any planes so they are not much more than a floating football field.
The idea that a frigate is a major warship, mmmmmm!
Umm yes a frigate is a major warship. You realise that the descriptor frigate and destroyer generally relate to task specialisation and nobody bothers with the term cruiser anymore.
I do know this.
I would not class an Arliegh Burke a major warship, it is an escort.
These RN vessels are even less.
DW
Calling an Arleigh Burke “an escort” is like calling a Main Battle Tank “an infantry support vehicle”, it’s technically one of its jobs, but it doesn’t reflect its full offensive potential. The U.S. Navy officially classifies the Arleigh Burke class as a Large Surface Combatant (LSC). They are also officially classified as Guided-Missile Destroyers (DDG), designed for high-end, offensive multi-mission warfare. At nearly 10,000 tons, the Arleigh Burkes are roughly twice the size of a traditional frigate and carry a much larger arsenal; 90–96 missile cells.
If a ship can provide Area Air Defence, protecting a whole fleet, and carry out Long-Range Land Attacks, like Tomahawk strikes, it is a major warship, regardless of its name. The Arleigh Burke is a “Fleet Destroyer,” which the U.S. Navy defines as a ship that can both escort high-value assets and operate offensively as the lead ship of a Surface Action Group.
“major warship” is an informal term used broadly by the public, the Navy uses the “Large Surface Combatant” designation to distinguish these heavy, multi-mission ships from “Small Surface Combatants” like frigates or Littoral Combat Ships.
As of early 2026, there are over 75 Arleigh Burkes active … 7ty fn’ 5 … with yet more under construction.
I thought that the Ticonderoga were cruisers.
They are the last few remnants of a previous generation..
Do you know what’s really interesting at one point the USN had cruisers that it had previously designated frigates it decided to call then cruisers later on.. so all the pre tico cruisers were actually built as frigates…so at one point USN would have considered a TICO equivalent ship a frigate.
The terms frigate, destroyers and cruisers are pretty irrelevant really in the modern world as Navies call there ships random designations for random reasons..even aircraft carriers get called odd names for funny reasons ( the Japanese for instance insist on calling their aircraft carriers destroyers). So nobody has officially built a cruiser in 40 years and yet the world is awash with 5000-90000 ton and 9000-14,0000 ton warships.
Most designations are to get funding, it is easier to get a frigate or destroyer than a cruiser.
As for the previous USN designations as frigates – it was because they were escorts, fleet escorts.
ABs are not cruisers because of their role – escorts. It is what they do. The Tico have C&C functions that make them major surface units, arguably cruisers in the modern parlance.
And yet the TICOs were not cruisers they were designed to be destroyers and only designated cruisers for political purposes. Started life as Destroyer (DDG-47).
Irony at work.
Fleet escorts with a command function.
I don’t think you can count HMS QE, just because she’s at sea doesn’t mean she can be deployed at the same time as PoW. It’ll be like before, just training until she relieves her sister ship from flagship duty.
Also how long are those 2 T23s going to remain? I expect it to be scaled down soon-ish.
Almost the whole of our available surface fleet then.🫣
Good.
It that the only other working Type 45 we have?
No
Well there is one with carrier, so now we have 3 fully working Type 45s?
Guys, She will only do this when hostilities end. She will not be put in harms way and will be there to assist.
It’s Resident Chumps mess, we will be waiting for It to be sorted.
its pointless when hostilities end as there will be zero need for warships then . If this drags on there comes a time when every nation with interests in the gulf will have to send ships and demand Iran opens international waters . Nevermind who started the madness me thinks 🙂
I didn’t miss that very pertinent point either. What actually will be their role if it’s deemed safe enough for ships (including war ships) to actually be there, ie no one actually firing missiles at all. Trying to show Europe is stepping up to the plate I guess, not that it will make Trump any happier I can hear the derision now as an add on to his claim no doubt to have stopped yet another war. But Keir no doubt will be waffling on about Britain leading the World with our allies to restore the Worlds economy, delusion-ally thinking it will stop him getting the sack. I wonder if Dragon will end up doing a U-turn.
Its comical that the RN can take the lead with France yet has barely one ship to provide for this international fleet , one that may break down at any time . Im not sure if we even have any traditional mine sweepers available . The best thing Kier Starmer can do to redeem himself before he goes is place another order all signed and paid for for another 6 frigates t31 t26s asap .His assistance for ukraine seems to be very good i think . Its just a shame he has totally missed the initiative on every thing else 🙂
We gave minesweepers sitting in the UK right now, they are neither needed or wanted in Hormuz.
What is wanted is RFA Lyme Bay packed with the worlds latest and probably greatest mine counter measure system
Greatest, says who, its never been tried for real. So its a guess. And Lyme Bay is big very under armed target which could not defend its self if had to from drones and fast gun boats. Or SSMs
It requires its own escort.
Shouldn’t let facts get in the way Martin.😏
So it seems to some.
👍😊
If you think ‘gap-filler’ RFA Lyme Bay is an under armed target then the actual ships designated to act as the real “Mother Ships” RFA Stirling Castle and RFA Proteus are potentially worse, at least RFA Lyme Bay has a military background whereas RFA Proteus and RFA Stirling Castle are essentially “civies in uniform.”
But the more I read about future optimisation of the whole Autonomous Mine Counter Measures (AMCM) systems, the more I like it, sure its early days, but great strides have been taken and impressive technicalities have been achieved, so its future looks to be very efficient.
I think they are all under armed, but at what range does the ship have to be from the mine clearing? That is the risk its distance from the clearance op. And none of those ships is any good in conflict zone.
20–30 miles back in “safer” water, however, mines are designed to trigger based on the signature, noise and magnetic field of a big ship. So 30 miles is plenty of distance to ensure Lyme Bay doesn’t accidentally set off the very mines her drones are trying to find.
20–30 miles is not “safe” in the age of the ubiquitous missile / drone, it is essentially the front door. In the current naval landscape of May 2026, 30 miles is well within the kill zone of almost every modern threat. If RFA Lyme Bay is sitting 30 miles back, she isn’t hiding; she is just giving herself a few extra seconds of reaction time.
Also there is the aim to to increase operational range, that’s one of the jobs for Peregrine, acting as an airborne repeater. Radio signals, especially the high-bandwidth ones needed to see 4K sonar feeds from a drone travel in straight lines. Because of the Earth’s curvature, if the drone is at sea level, the signal cuts out at about 20–30 miles.
Using the Peregrine or the Wildcat helicopters as flying routers. By hovering a helicopter halfway between the ship and the minefield, they can bounce the signal over the horizon. This could instantly push the mothership back to 60 or 70 miles, putting it much further away from shore-based gun batteries.
The real focus is on Edge Autonomy. This is the biggest shift, instead of a human on the ship driving the drone via a video feed, which requires a massive constant data link, the drones are being taught to think for themselves. Automatic Target Recognition (ATR) … The drone goes out, scans the seabed, identifies a mine using its own internal AI brain, and only sends back a tiny “blip” of data to the ship saying, “Hey I found one, do I blow it up?”
Because this requires very little data, you can use low-frequency radio that travels much further, allowing the ship to stay much further back. But power is also an issue as the drones require power to operate all day long.
The current experimental solution, being tested right now in the Atlantic High North, Operation Firecrest where they are testing a ‘Smart PowerBuoy’. A small, rugged buoy is dropped into the water by a ship or helicopter. It has solar panels and wave-energy converters. Underwater drones can navigate to this buoy, dock with it under the surface, and sip power, it’s a “recharge while you wait” system that allows the mothership to stay even much further back.
Will it be stopping the boats of the IRGN?
I think Dragon is post PIP so has three MTU (3MW) V-20 Series 4000 DGs not the two older power plants…
It was surprise to me but one of the reoccurring tends in the local elections was concerns over defence. Now we know farage is in the pocket of the kremin /trump, so not the answer (more time abroad than UK slagging off the UK, repeating Russian lines, is not someone to be trusted with defence), but it will be interesting if there is a reaction from it in respect of the DIP. Labour are toast either way but will be interesting what they do in the next 2 years
Yes Farage is just s traitor who again has no idea of international affairs and Britains interests . I think Kemi would be better with national security , just shows how the generations of politicians have declined the more time moves on away from ww2 and the cold war.
It is amazing that you have a major party leader talking to US Congress and begging that they put in place sanctions against the UK and it doesn’t make wall to wall news for months, self interest to the extreme. However it would now take a miracle for him not to be the next PM. Putin must be laughing right now, first his puppet trump and next farage. However 2-3 year to the next election, hopefully in that time we can find a peace deal for Ukraine or they are stuffed.
Even a rock would be better than Starmer’s government on defense matters, basically because its only policy is to leave the United Kingdom without armed forces.
CdeG is obviously the centrepiece of the European TG being assembled in the Arabian Sea region, but she and her aircraft group have been hard worked for 18 months now, and continuously deployed since January. Hard to see her being able to manage more than 2 or 3 months in the region. I suspect ITS Cavour is being lined up to take over, but obviously she’s a much smaller and less capable asset. Will the UK government finally get its act to together and volunteer QE or POW with a squadron of F-35B’s? As ever, it is unfortunate that the QEC are not CATABOR, and can’t embark some aircraft from the Aéronautique Navale to bring the air group up to a decent strength strength.
France is sending 1 carrier, 8 Frigates, 2 assault ships, and 2 support ships
You are quoting the total number of naval assets that France has deployed across the region, albeit a number that puts the UK and RN to shame. USNI reports that the French CSG now in the Red Sea includes Charles de Gaulle (R91), the air defence destroyer Chevalier Paul (D621), 1 or 2 French FREMM-class frigates, the fleet oiler Jacques Chevallier (A725) and possibly a nuclear powered attack submarine. French media reports c. 6 May claimed that CSG also included the Netherlands frigate HNLMS Evertsen (F805) and the Italian frigate ITS Alpino (F494), but that seems incorrect. E.g. the Netherlands Ministry of Defense has confirmed that Evertsen left the CSG in early May and is now returning home from the Eastern Med.
The presence of Dragon will be reassuring to the French and US given the excellent performance by Diamond against the Houthis
One ship of ours will reasure the USA. Ok ?
It doesn’t take much to counter the Houthis though…
The Danes will tell you otherwise
Fereh, Really? The Houthis are quite good at attacking shipping in the Strait.
Just one? Where are the other Daring class destroyers?
Duncan is defending Europe’s Northern Flank alongside a British carrier and frigate force.
Dauntless is in short-term maintenance.
Dragon is in the Easter Med.
Defender is in long-term maintenance, receiving CAMM cells.
Diamond is PIP? (Not sure on that one)
Daring is regenerating.
So out of the 6, one is with POW which is expected, and Dragon is running around doing everything in the med, and now the middle east. It’s really quite shocking.
Correct – Diamond follows Defender in having PIP and CAAM Upgrade combined,Duncan likely to follow.Daring still the Gift that keeps on giving.
Yes RN ships and their crews send to be very well trained and dependable – Diamond a great example. HMS Gloucester another
So, can HMS Dragon now defend itself against intermediate range ballistic missiles? Because our air defence destroyers have previously had to shelter under the wing of US Aegis systems for that pesky and un-cricket-like missile dropping down from straight above thing, right? The short range one HMS Diamond was within the envelope of the current Asters, but intermediate ones are not. Please tell me I am wrong and why.
The RN clearly believe Dragon is able to do something against MRBMs with her current missiles. I’d remind the majority that the A30B1 doesn’t actually do anything revolutionary to the missile. There’s a new warhead IIRC, but given A30 is a HTK missile, it’s more of a redundancy. The A30B1NT adds a new seeker, but that’s about it.
Much of the improvements are software based, and so can be performed at relatively short notice. It’s widely believed that French frigates in the Red Sea performed emergency modifications to their CMS in order to improve their BMD capability.
The RN has been drilling Dragon’s crew against MRBM threats as well. I mean, the idea tends to be to ‘degrade gracefully under pressure’.
Ehhhh..Samson can see into space but not space directly above the ship. If your talking about terminal phase of MRBM targetting Dragon from directly above then Dragon will need a vertical facing radar.
If your talking about launch phase within range or terminal phase of MRBM, and in terminal phase that MRBM is targetting something dozens of KMs away, then current system may have an opportunity to engage.
Maybe a vertical facing panel has been added somewhere on the ship…atop the Hanger?
Contrary to popular belief, BMs don’t tend to hit a screeching 90 degree turn and plunge straight downwards. Physics makes that really difficult to do. They will be at a steep angle, but SAMPSON can angle its beam as well.
I don’t think there’s a vertically-facing panel on the ships.
Gloucester – I was on her in the Persian Gulf back in 1995/6 when Commander Chris Parry was her Captain. He seemed a higher flyer destined for great things, but presumably blotted his copy book at some point.
Another question: Isn’t the delayed remedy to our defenceless air defence doomed to failure? It takes forever for Euro Sam to surge production and even when they do, it will only be by a number of hundreds of missiles, compared to the thousands of ballistic missiles produced just by Iran, never mind Russia. Obviously, once the magazine is exhausted, any air defence ship is at the mercy of the enemy and so are all the ships that depend upon her. If the answer is to focus on killing the archers rather than shooting down the arrows, that does not seem to have worked so well with Iran. The archers still live and in large numbers. What, then, is the rationale behind investing billions into these ships? What answer is there? I assume those on high know what they are doing, but if you look at history, maybe not.
If you run out of interceptors onboard the ship, you pull the ship out of reach and rearm.
There are very, very few scenarios in which Iran could feasibly launch 16 or more BMs against a EuroCSG with any serious accuracy.
If you cannot keep up with the rate of BM production, you directly attack their production sites, either through TLAM, MdCN or Storm Shadow.
Just some thoughts: A ship can’t pull out of range very quickly and may already be well within the range of the attacker. The accuracy of the BMs could improve very rapidly, in the near future. If the answer is to strike their production facilities, that can’t protect one or more of our ships caught out when they start a fight. Surely, the answer has to be an innovative interceptor, like Sky Hammer, that is cheaper then the BMs, can be packed in great numbers on ships, produced in greater numbers than the BMs and produced here in the UK, so we don’t have to wait at the back of the queue?
My response to that arrives from the locations:
1) Targeting a warship is very difficult. Systems like BMs need almost real-time targeting updates in order to actually impact a ship, because, though it sounds simple, ship can move. Accuracy may improve on the missile itself, but that doesn’t really cover the hole. If you have a really accurate rifle, but don’t know which way to point it, your rifle really isn’t that useful, despite its accuracy. Similarly, time-on-target attacks are also very difficult, and dropping enough missiles on a ship to overwhelm it in one attack is very tough.
2) You don’t wait for your ship to fully empty its magazines before pulling it out. You maintain a baseline.
3) Interceptors for MRBMs will never be cheaper than the MRBMs themselves. Starhammer (the ABM-equivalent cousin of Skyhammer) is in no way capable enough for MRBM defence.
If this country had been managed correctly since the second World War we should have been in a position of strength. We could have said to Trump I’m sorry but this is an ill advised and timed war. What will you do about the straights of Hormuz. When as was obvious from the start there was no plan we should have been in a position to say, OK regardless it is unacceptable for the Iranians to block a sea lane. We, the British who’s survival freedom and prosperirty has for many hundreds of years relied on the sea lanes will commit to keep this choke point open. Any British Government that has allowed the Royal Navy to get to a state where it cannot perform such a task has failed in its duty to the British people. When I was born, despite the already bad governments we had endured this would still have been possible. Now it is not. This is pure negligence. Yes the threat and means of attacking littoral shipping has advanced but sea power has always had to adapt to new threats. There is no reason why the straights of Hormuz cannot be kept open and there is no reason why, apart from treasonous mismanagement it should not be the Royal Navy doing it.
👍
What fantasy land do you live in? The UK is in exactly the position its voters desire it to be in. And the idea that the UK is going to deter any American President, especially Trump, from acting in what he perceives to be in the American national interest died 82 years ago on the Normandy beaches.
Exactly the declinist defeatist attitude that has put us where we are. None of this was inevitable and we simply should not have allowed this level of mismanagement to have occurred. You didn’t really read what I said, as I didn’t say we could have deterred Trump only that we should be in a position to point out the clear lack of planning and to be able to deal with the consequences from a position of strength.
As long as it is there to defend against the aggressor in this warm against the piracy of the USA then I don’t have a problem, if we are supporting the USA then we should support Russia against Ukraine, china against Taiwan and we should acknowledge trump as the world ruler and our master. Did Starmer not learn from the elections? The British people want someone to stand for our rights, principles and history not against us
The difference here is that Trumps bad, the Iranian regime are far worse. Our dispute with him should be over tactics where I think he has really miscalculated.
Russia’s intentions in Ukraine, like China’s in Tawain, are evil and we should wish to oppose them.
Sadly Trumps intentions and threats in Iran are as bad as Putins in Ukrain and Chinas in Taiwan. The SA is also – quietly while others are looking elsewhere – committing genocide in Cuba. In terms of killing people on made up excuses the USA is way ahead of ANY other country in the world. This doesnt mean I am a fan of the Iranian regime, people I know have had family killed by them, but even so Trumps beyond the pale totally.
There may be other more pressing concerns?
‘Russia’s Defense Ministry has already published a target list on NATO territory: 27 defense‑industry sites that either work with Ukraine or for Ukraine’
‘In recent days, the regime’s talking heads on every propaganda channel have been solemnly persuading one another, and their commander‑in‑chief, that striking these facilities is absolutely necessary to “save the Orthodox Fatherland.” Among them are a few genuinely serious military experts, such as Dmitry Trenin, a former GRU analyst and until recently the director of the Carnegie Moscow Center.’
UK (3 addresses):
Mildenhall, 2 West Row Road (Fire Point)
London, King Edward Street, 17 (Horizon Tech)
Leicester, Meridian North Block 5 (Horizon Tech)
The British Public should be told, immediately, what steps have been taken by their government to protect them against this threat…
You know the rest…
I’m sure NATO has a “list” on them too.
Unfortunately, right or wrong, after Britain and the U.S. twice reneged on security assurances within the Budapest Memorandum, after the chaotic withdrawal from Kabul, after President Trump’s recent comprehensive falling out with Europe, Russia no longer believes NATO deterrence has any credibility…
Can imagine the discussion between the policiticans and admiral’s has been what can we send and is there anything we can do to rush more ships to give a positive image after all the negative headlines. The fact they have only managed one ship after what a month, says a lot about what would be available if there was a war.
It’s always hard to know how many of the out of service ships could be rushed to readiness if needed, but now we know. If one ship then the navy is effectively not capable of war fighting.
No it doesn’t Steve because if there is a war it will be in the north and Atlantic where we currently have three type 23’s and aircraft carrier and a type 45 leading a NATO flotilla of 6 more ships.
This is why we don’t have more ships in the gulf and it’s why France doesn’t have more ships in the North Atlantic.
Since 2010 we have operated a combined joint expeditionary force with France which involves one of us having a carrier on high readiness at all times. And since the UK took over Joint Force Command Norfolk giving us operational control over the entire North Atlantic, Arctic and Northern Europe we agreed to deploy a carrier along with NATO standing Force 1.
I really don’t understand how people don’t get this.
I wonder why they haven’t sent them ships. I get the real threat is in the north Atlantic but it’s not a threat in the near future and right now the navy needs some good news stories or they are going to find it a nightmare to recruit.
Carrier is clear, we dont have the supply ships to deploy it.
We don’t need supply ships to deploy to the gulf, we have a massive logistics base in Oman right in the AO.
However our navy is as much use in the straits of Hormuz as the US navy which is to say no use at all.
We are not sending more ships because there is no way for the navy to force the straits open. It’s going as part of a multi national force with moral authority to oversee a peace settlement no impose one.
It’s worth reminding everyone that we literally just had a major Russian incursion into the North Atlantic attempting to interfere with our cables and the entire US navy and now French navy are heavily deployed in the Indian Ocean. So we and NATO very much need our navy in the North Atlantic.
The navy is no use at stopping russian interference with cables. What can they realistically do to stop theem, as they cant open fire. Just media stories of the navy stopping russian ships.
Europe including the UK are getting ready to support shipping once a peace deal is achieved. For sure they won’t be doing anything until then, as it’s a US mess and not ours to sort. What the suport will look like is anyone’s guess at this stage.
The navy is every use at doing this, it’s exactly what it did last month. No one wants their very expensive super secret nuclear submarine to have its acoustic signature recorded at close range and anything they place on or near the cables can be intercepted and removed by HMS Proteus.
Did what? All they can do is mirror the ship, it doesn’t prevent them from doing whatever they were there for.
Getting new state of the art vessels, increasing vessel numbers overall and providing good conditions and ok pay will boost recruitment.
An ever decreasing fleet doest send a message of employment security or career future.
I guess it’s possible they are still in the planning stage. Peace isn’t going to happen anytime soon with trump being so flip flops what he is after and Israel in his ear. Gives a bit more time to work on freeing up ships
Interesting Op in the last hour or so, as 16 Bde medics have parachuted into Tristan Da Cunha to help a Brit who left that cruise ship with hantavirus..
I wonder if we’ll have an article about it here.
One. So parachuting cannot be just done away with as some wanted, niche capabilities need it.
Two. Rich of the Foriegn Secretary to be Grandstanding again, talking of helping Brits wherever they are in the world.
Hello? You talk of NATO, you talk of withdrawing from overseas, you keep cutting the enabling assets of the military, such as vital transport aircraft, you review paradrop training, and so on and so on.
Low and behold, this comes up in the other side of the world.
Good job we have para trained medics eh? And the RAF AT force to put them there?
Good news story on the bravery of British forces and the ability to rapidly deploy medical assistance to one of the most remote places on planet earth and you can still put a negative spin on it.
You could get a job on Fleet Street no issues 😀
Nope, the negativity is targeted at politicians who contradict themselves by their words and actions, whan world events make them look stupid.
There was nothing negative about the op itself, indeed, I emphasised why such forces are necessary.
Hey, you yourself wanted more of the RAF ATF cut a few months back by losing the C17s, so further strain on the Atlas force, which is needed to cover the unexpected and eventualities like this.
Nice try with spinning it, Jim.
Fleet Street? Noo, you could work in the communications department of Downing Street!
You’re doing a good job here trying to defend the undefendable!
Thinking further! I’d love a job in Fleet Street in the defence department, they might get a journalist who actually knows something about Britain’s military, wider Defence, and the intelligence community! 😳
That surely beats 5 inch guns compared to tooth brushes and Battleships compared to Frigates.
Can you imagine someone like me having articles read by millions in newspapers, holding HMG feet to the fire over Defence, pointing out the hypocrisy in their words, and laying out the orbat of the military on a weekly basis for the interested but uninformed?
As opposed to on a niche Defence site like this reas by, I don’t know, tens of thousands?
I expect I’d be getting a knock on the door eh?
I thought “Fleet Street” Papers all closed down decades ago ?
Maybe Jim still lives in the 1980’s ?
Might explain some of his Optimistic “Glass almost full” to “Glass Overflowing” RN capability comments ?
I’m only Joking Jim.
Keep up the great work, It’s good to see one poster having such a positive spin on things.
I’m too young to remember the 1980’s so that probably explains my glass half full outlook 😉
I’m sure in a few decades I’ll feel like the youth are all lazy and gaze through my rose tinted NHS provider spectacles to reminisce about the good old days when politicans like David Cameron, Liz Truss, Boris Johnson and Kier Starmer where honest and competent people, defence was well funded and pot holes were filled in quickly. 😀
I mis Boris !
No seriously though, He’s the polar opposite of Starmer.
A Crazy man with a distinctive personality. Sadly has none of either, just drab, boring and Deaf.
Defo mate, positivity is needed, and the are countless areas of our military capability ( not size ) to be positive about.
It’s the governments I cannot abide by their words and actions, or should I say inaction?
But your inventing cuts that haven’t happened, no one has cut the transport fleet since 2021 and none of those politicans remain.
I personally would cut the C17 in favour of more F35’s and E7’s but I’m not in charge. (Yet 😉)
Eeeek!
I’m the opposite, I favour the enablers as much as the fighty stuff.
But whatever, no worries Jim. 👍
I think all the cases are still linked to the cruise ship but as the passengers get spread out around the world rather than contained in one place, it makes the chances of a mistake happening far more likely. Especially as they don’t yet know how it spread.
After our posts, I had a look. Infected Rat from a rubbish tip at the southern tip of Argentina? The passengers went ashore apparently.
Or, there was speculation the Rodent got inboard. 🐀
That’s the theory but so far they haven’t been able to prove either way.
From what I read the world health organisation is trying to track down the source.
Rat’s get a bad press.
It was Rat’s that brought the Plague to England, Weymouth apparently.
Cute and Intelligent little “Critters” though.
(I used the word “Critters” as It looks like our American “Members” are here en masse again).
(I used the word “Members” as I know that calling them “Jonsons” Is almost Insulting and I wouldn’t want to Insult the Thick Twats on a public site).
😁
Well, I think the animal kingdom us underestimated by ignorant humans anyway. So yes, I’ve read that pet Rats make great companions, are affectionate, intelligent, love their human, and give unconditional love.
Like many animals.
What a lovely world us humans are destroying eh?
But yes, sadly, Rats in the wild can be a big problem, even though all they’re doing is trying to live their life….
The “Americas” version of the Hantavirus is probably the worse one to get, as it it infects the heart and lungs, which leads to a greater number of fatalities.
Worrying sign. Let’s hope this isn’t the start of COVID 2. It seems to be spreading.
I must admit, beyond the news reports the other day I have not looked into it. J is the man to comment.
I believe the nurse and doctor were tandem jumped in. This is still a big deal, as the landing sight is the only real flat piece of the volcanic island. Which has a predominant westerly wind. Meaning they would have had to have been dropped over the sea to make land. Though I’d hope that the Tristan islanders had a couple boats in the area just in case?
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Bravo to the British army medics and troops who parachuted onto Tristan da Cunha to deliver medical aid. 👏🏻
The headline mentioned the medics dropping in, but reading further, it was interesting that two dropped in tandem, nurse and a Doctor. You see that done in recreational skydiving but not I’d not seen it with the military? Apart from some footage of MWD serving with SF who obviously could not drop alone.
Airborne?
I like to see them jump back out again, alas, It’ll be by Boat, eventually.
There once was a Tristan De Cunha Stamp listed as the Worlds most expensive in the Guiness book of records.
“Not a lot of people know that” 😎
Guessing the doc and the nurse are not as experienced as the others that went in. Given they’re dropping onto a small island with no SAR if they ended up in the water, it seems a safe precaution.
They were “Buddy” dropped.
Bravo, Hoorah, Tally Ho 😁
Hope we stay well clear of the area until Trump stops playing idiot-in-chief with Iran. Pre-positioning is fine, but Trump could spin this out by design, or usual incompetance quite some time to grift as much as he can from markets & avoid Epstien accountability. Someone should tell him he hasn’t got “the cards” & is “playing with WW3”. It is criminal & insane what he’s doing in the USA if you look closely.
The King’s Speech, scheduled for this Wednesday, May 13 is the absolute go/no-go moment for defense. In parliamentary terms, it is the Government’s manifesto for the next year … if it’s not in the speech, it’s not happening
Scenario A – The Speech includes a Defence Readiness or National Resilience focus. The result is that the UK is serious about 2026 warfare, and items like an EW umbrella for all Challenger 3 tanks might actually get funded.
Scenario B – The Speech focuses on Social Contracts and Civil Preparedness without new money. The result is that the DIP is dead, the RFA Stirling Castle is the best we’re getting … no MRSS and the industry starts pivoting away from UK defense.
In two days, the gossip ends and the reality begins. If you’re a betting man, the House of Lords Library is currently betting on Scenario B, lots of talk, no new Bill. House of Lords Library Research Briefing LLN-2026-0010, published on May 7, 2026, titled “King’s Speech 2026: Defence.”
The Library is “betting B” because the math doesn’t support Scenario A.
According to the briefing, the only “new” defense-related items are … The Diego Garcia/British Indian Ocean Territory Bill, essentially a land-deal/treaty bill and Cyber Resilience measures … Which are cheap compared to tanks and ships.
The House of Lords Library isn’t just guessing; they are analyzing the lack of paperwork coming out of the MOD. If there was a big Bill coming on Wednesday, the “Drafting Offices” would have seen it by now. They haven’t.
I wonder how this will spin out, A’s not looking good.
Considering I’ve never had any faith that this government has any interest whatsoever in Defence beyond job creation and rhetoric, I’m not surprised.
We are to be a small star on the EUs flag, and a declining one.
Nothing more.
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