The Ministry of Defence has again confirmed that the planned Type 32 frigates are set to enter service in the 2030s.
This recent confirmation emerged in a response to a written parliamentary question posed in the House of Commons.
In an exchange dated 7 September 2023, John Healey, the Shadow Secretary of State for Defence, inquired about the in-service date of the first Type 32 frigate.
In reply, James Cartlidge, the Minister of State for the Ministry of Defence, stated: “The Type 32 programme has not yet reached the level of maturity to publish specific In-Service dates, as is consistent with a programme of this size and complexity at this stage in its development. On current plans the Type 32s are due to enter service in the 2030s.”
The official confirmation comes after yet more speculation regarding the future of the Type 32 Frigate.
The UK Government had previously responded to the Scottish Affair Committee’s Fourth Report of Session 2022–23, which addressed defence in Scotland, especially military shipbuilding.
Amidst media conjectures about the Type 32’s future, the government emphasised:
“Turning to the Type 32 Frigate programme, this remains a key part of the future fleet. Work continues to ensure the programme is affordable in order to deliver the ships the Royal Navy and Marines need. These ships will be UK-built, with the procurement route yet to be determined. It is absolutely the intention of the Royal Navy to have more frigates and destroyers. The T32 programme is currently in concept phase, after which the procurement strategy will be decided.“
Fingers crossed they won’t get cancelled by a future government . The fleet needs more ships
Has done since the late 80’s
2030s may as well mean 2039. They won’t be cancelled but no guarantee they will come anytime soon. The government has been taking about T26 since the late 90s now and it’s still years away from entering service.
Annoyingly vague. Why not say, early or mid late 30s? Or give a specific year! Looks like the T32 is going to be a bit of a blend of T23 GP and MCM roles and hopefully it has good ASW capabilities. And be bold, order 6!
Placeholder ACME Frigate. Beep beep.
Ah! Alex sorry not to reply to your reply to my AdamSmith analogy. I’ve been off grid for a week…bliss. Now I can’t find it. Anyway not to worry. Onwards and upwards 🙂
No problem, I also don’t remember where it was 🙂
👍👍
The MOD should stop wasting money/resources and just order more T31, the T31 is a cheap, capable platform and is currently in build so if the aim is to have more ships it would be cheaper/quicker to just add more.
But the requirements will be different.
There’s a reason they are cheap…
Yes more ships are needed but they need to have the right capability or they will be a useless money pit.
Ther are enough pits we’re already throwing money into, Like Dew. On top of the problem , will be the design of the T83 To contend with
I think a tweaked T31 with the the option for noise reduction so it’s can perform ASW using a towed array is the answer. The existing design can incorporate this, Babcock even offered it as an option. It’s also important to rember that these T32 is going to be replacing our armed MCM capability. Having a bow ramp for USV’s and UUV’s is likely important. Babcock already has this design on show, hopefully costs are similar to T31 however I don’t think e would be severed by just having 5 more T31. A general purpose medium frigate like T31 is… Read more »
T32 won’t happen. Like DEW it’s pie in the sky rubbish. We’ve got our hands full with T31 and T26. another class is in achievable.save the money to double the T31ORDER, or build another T26.
Agree , if the design is sound and cheap then build more of them rather than waste money designing a new one
Bow ramp?
don’t you want to mean stern?
Cancel it. Double the T31order. at the price per ship it makes sense
Think of T32 as T31 Batch 2
The T32 may require GT’s burning H2!
Power generation needs for directed energy weapons, drone support and silo size seems to be the unknown at the moment for ships that will serve from the 2030s to 2060s potentially.
If more numbers are needed now then add a few Type 31 + ( TAS etc).
It might make sense therefore for the Type 32 to be a new design, the trend would suggest bigger ships with smaller crew.. Maybe a smaller Hull form of the T4xx destroyer with a less complex sensor and AA weapons fit.
I think the choice is going to be between (and CDS confimed this to Defence Committee in his last meeting as 1SL):
T31 Batch 2T31 Batch 2 but with RR mission bay from T26 added amidshipsAn all new BAe T32 modular frigate offering.Both of the latter may use ‘The Cube’ modular system developed by Danish company, SH Defence (both Babcock and BAe are partners in development of that system).
The VARD 125 NGOPV design is also a possible. VARD are looking at a version designed around the CUBE interchangeable pods system, which I believe the RN are also interested in.
https://shdefence.com/the-cube/
Page down if it doesn’t position to the PR video
A better link to the video
https://vimeo.com/781407458/1d8bd3c1a5
An upgraded version of the US Coast Guard’s Offshore Patrol Cutter. The text in the video doesn’t match the armament shown, but it’s a much better fit than the USCG version. If they could automate and get crew down to about 100-150, it could be a good FFG.
I agree – looks like it’s focussed on a US requirement, but substitute a few systems (57mm for 76mm, 40mm for SeaRam, etc) and it starts to look like a decent fit for what little we actually know about the T32 requirement. (Basically, the BAE Adaptable Frigate proposal vs the T-31 with mission bay from Babcocks) It may also have the benefit of being a reasonably simple and complete design. Good for Babcocks to pick up after the T-31 build completes. I like the fact that it can be configured for an ASW role, as this would compliment the potential… Read more »
DEW? fools gold, not in our generation.
Given the lack of ASW capabilities of the T31 and T45, it’s essential that the T32 is a primarily ASW asset
If you want a high end ASW platfrom just order more T26, perhaps a stretched version for a larger mission bay… The T32 is going to be a GP frigate but it could have improved ASW capability, perhaps by exploiting embarked autonomous vehicles. From recent posts / stuff I’ve read / watched the advantage is with the sub so I think the RN is looking for game changing tech with the apparent focus on off platform vehicles being used to widen the effective search area that an escort is able to cover. Unfortunately, the technology is developing very quickly at… Read more »
I imagine that the future for ASW may involve a UUV operating with a towed array, or maybe being thought of more as a remote array in its own right. POtentially a couple of those deployed from each ships mission bay in future could provide an incredible amount of coverage around a flotilla. Heavy lift drones could then be used to drop sonobuoys and maybe one day to use dipping sonar (or maybe that function stays on the Merlins for a while yet). As well as Merlin dropped torpedoes, other drones could then be called in to drop them as… Read more »
Echo and enterprise could operate a towed array, they were designed to to do it.
My understanding the 32 will be a multi mission ship with containerised sensors and weapon systems. My worry is these ships will be expected to do everything thus becoming a complex and expensive platform.
May as well fit them out for doing survey ships
Type 32 will be a priority until it’s not.
There is not sufficient money for Type 32, MRSS, SSN-AUKUS, sufficient investment in unmanned systems, etc.. Something will give eventually. But right up until the last moment, the Government will pretend that it can do it all … until it can’t.
We’ve blown billions on T26 and astutes for years type 32? No chance, might as well go for a batch 2 type 31, fitted with the systems that the first batch won’t have. Some nations are developing dedicated ASw Corvettes, cheap and effective when the batch 2 rivers start their first major refits, they could be reconfigured to do it too.
T32 may just be an up-gunned T31, using the same hull with something like twin Phalanx CIWS, CAMM launchers to free up the Mk41 VLS cells for anti-ship/land attack and 324mm torpedo launchers (which the Polish version of T31 will be getting). The batch 2 OPVs probably aren’t ideal for ASW, they weren’t designed for quiet operating and lack proper aviation facilities.
The key question is whether Labour, who are certainly going to be the next government are committed to the programme. Its a pity the programme isn’t advanced enough to sign contracts in blood with gigantic cancellation clauses before the end of this parliament.
We have to provide shipbuilders that certainty and increase the RN fighting power from the frankly pitiful force levels we can muster currently.
Can u guarantee that labour will win the next election? I don’t think it can be called yet. The pollsters have been wrong plenty times before.
John curtice seems to be the best bet for reliable predictions. But as he says it’s only predictions and things can change
Why another ship with undefined spec?Type 31s could be stretched or reconfigured which would speed up the delivery.Babcock can easily build 5 or 10 more ships with a tweaked design.Still be in the water faster than the last Type 26.
If any T32 be needed for RN, it must be on very late 2030s and early 2040s. At this moment, man-power level of RN can barely fill the 8 T26s and 5 T31s. Similar to T23GP, T31 could be “double manned”, so there is even more margin in hulls, but not in man-power. Fingers cross that all 8 T26 and 5 T31 have their crew (of course, maintenance rotation means, 7 T26 and 4-5 T31 will be manned). When the T31hull1 and T26hull1 come to an age of 15 years or so, they will go into mid-life refit. In this… Read more »
Makes sense, T32 has not yet completed design , specification and costing, so given that, it is difficult to accurately project an in service date.
The delay to the concept phase output is unnecessary. Decisions could be made and designs started, or even just some open discussion and debate, but that would break the customary vacillation to the last possible second followed by the traditional series of rushed and risky choices.
It must the weather or lack of Beer but I actually think the Ministers reply is both reasonable and understandable. Everyone seems to want to order this or that and seem completely clueless about the realities of rebuilding the RN back up to a reasonable force level with the right capabilities. But as I have said before, right now the U.K. is maxed out financially but things are beginning to look up. So why do I say reasonable ? All the U.K shipbuilding capacity is working to a pre determined build schedule as per the National Shipbuilding Strategy and it… Read more »
Yep,ABC I get your reasoning.unfortunatly BW’s not Minister. We’ve a clown 🤡 instead. Anything can happen within the next 30 minutes,to quote that puppet TV show.👍👌😏🤡
Actually it doesn’t matter who takes over from BW he has pretty well stitched it all up in such a way no idiot can mess it up. The RFA’s are bought and being finished for trials, the T31’s have been beefed up a effective surface combatants, contracts signed. Its a done deal, the RN is back on top of the pile with the RAF second and the Army relegated to being a smaller but flexible land strike force. It makes perfect sense if you look at the way NATO is heading, the Eastern former WP countries are arming up for… Read more »
At last. A sensible, well thought out post compared to the moaning with no context efforts.
Ta Mr M, I just get fed up reading pie in the sky comments with no clear understanding of reality. I just remember that you don’t buy extra products based on a sales brochure. Let’s see how the T31 goes and then make an informed choice. My guts tell me they will hit issues with the fitting out of Venturer and she will be 2/3 years late but subsequently they will then speed up due to the learning curve. But overall the completion of the class will be 1/2 years late. But that is still a damn good achievement from… Read more »
There are a lot of them to be fair.
There were 16 T23’s built and the vast majority were built at Scotstoun their 1st took 5 years form keel laying to commisioned. But as their learning curve went up so did the build rate and when they got their swing going St Albans took 3 years 2 months.
But a T23 was way smaller than a T31 so I’ll be intrigued to see how things go.
And one thing is for sure based on the RN experience with POW the commisioning crew QC folks will be all over it like a swarm of wasps.
T32 won’t happen. The program will be cancelled so they can justify the loss of an Albion as a major cost cutting exercise. I’d prefer to see the T31’S order doubled.
I would be very interersted if someone in the know could comment on whether the current RN recruitment/training/overall manpower planning is consistent with being able to properly cover crewing requirements for all there new vessels?
The Type 31 has an opportunity to be a more affordable force multiplier than the Type 26. Countries that have adopted the expensive (and late) Type 26 and its variants, could instead add at least 3 Type 31s for each Type 26 saved. Canada was expected to build 15 Type 26 variants. I don’t see that happening, and they’ll eventually reduce that number to 8 or 9, and could then order another 8 or 9 Type 31s with improved armament than the RN version and still save money. Australia is already considering reducing their build of 9 Hunter/Type 26 class.… Read more »
I think the biggest problem is the lgbtq situation, let’s not worry about ships they are but details…….
Let’s not have the fence sitting Kiwis (who can barely operate a navy of any sort) trying to get the Aussies to downgrade their fleet.