A situation where a person is exclusively exposed to those who hold the same beliefs and values as them is referred to as a “echo chamber.”
In the era of social media, when users can select to follow or communicate with only individuals who share their opinions, this tendency has become more widespread.
This can result in a skewed perception of reality and lead to people making false assumptions about specific subjects, such as the notion that no frigates are being constructed in Scotland.
This article is the opinion of the author and not necessarily that of the UK Defence Journal. If you would like to submit your own article on this topic or any other, please see our submission guidelines.
There are literally thousands of tweets about the new frigates, ranging from absurd claims that no ships are being built at all to more understandable but still false claims that only five ships have been ordered. The former, I assume is either wilful ignorance and the latter is clearly from folk that are unfamiliar with the fact that ships are ordered in batches.
Jonathan Chartier, a defence commentator, took a detailed look at this. He said that one key issue that has had significant influence over the often torrid debate when it comes to military ship building in Scotland is the reduction of the Type 26 procurement from thirteen to eight vessels, whilst ignoring the ordering of another five frigates of a different type.
“The often passionate arguments from those who support and oppose Scottish independence makes a balanced view of military ship building in Scotland and its future difficult, as it can often end up with people shouting their ‘preferred’ facts at each other over social media rather than examining the issues. Traditionally, the Royal Navy has purchased ship classes from multiple yards, in distinct batches.
This not only spreads programme costs, but also allows for changes and improvements to the base design and rectification work, as well as for keeping shipyards open with a constant steady stream of work. Certainly, for famous classes like the Type 12I Leander, this batch production was necessary just to keep up with the radical changes seen in electronics and systems over their extensive career.”
The belief that there are no frigates being built in Scotland is a prime example of the dangers of an echo chamber. This belief is often based on a misunderstanding of numerous reports on the frigates, more on this can be found here.
Here’s a perfect example of a headline people shared without reading. If they had read it, they’d see that it was a subsystem being built in France not the ship.
Well, the infamously badly headlined @Plymouth_Live article regarding the Type 31 Frigates has resulted in thousands of tweets about how 'Scotland has been betrayed!' and 'France are building British Frigates!'. Well done folks, well done. pic.twitter.com/N13dcRR6Ph
— UK Defence Journal (@UKDefJournal) February 11, 2020
This sharing without reading, sharing without caring, etc, leads to a false conclusion that the frigates themselves were not being built in Scotland, despite evidence to the contrary.
Echo chambers are created when people only consume information from sources that confirm their existing beliefs, and they actively block or ignore any information that contradicts those beliefs.
You’ll see this if you follow me on Twitter. My polite corrections to folk claiming that no ships are being built are often met with abuse and blocking.
In the above example, when I politely pointed out that in fact thirteen ships were ordered, can you guess what happened? I was blocked. This is a normal response and frankly, mind blowing.
An “echo chamber” is created when someone only associates with people who share their beliefs and values, which can reinforce one’s own viewpoints while potentially excluding others. Contrary to what might seem to be the case, echo chambers frequently result from inadvertent cognitive biases and social practices.
People have a tendency to seek out information and social ties that confirm their own beliefs and values, which is known as confirmation bias. Social pressure to adhere to group norms, which can make people hesitant to express alternative ideas, can further intensify the echo chamber effect. Hence, even while people might not purposefully create an echo chamber, it is nevertheless possible for them to do so as a result of their natural human instincts.
People may not appreciate having their political opinions challenged since they are frequently entwined with their sense of self. Those who identify with a certain political party or ideology could perceive an attack on that philosophy as an attack on them personally.
This can lead to defensiveness and a reluctance to engage with opposing viewpoints, which is likely why folk don’t like to be told that ships are being built in Scotland.
Bloody hell. lol
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You do remember this is a defence site right?
Yes but generally most people don’t agree with each other on this site which is what makes it fun.
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I disagree with that! We’re all of one mind here!
I completely disagree with you disagreeing with me.
I agree.
Well I don’t agree that your agreeing, I think your actually disagreeing….I refute your agreement 😂😂😂
I am a Scot but pro Union and trying to argue with a fervent SNP supporter is akin to trying to persuade Donal Trump that he has lost once, twice and thrice,
A complete waste of breath you might as well talk to yourself.
But things may well change with NS departing, there is a body of opinion in a lot of the SNP that it may be a good idea to actually govern the country for a change.
Or the $#1t is about to hit the fan.
There was a time we English looked up to the Scottish education system. Governing devolved responsibilties properly before seeking ever more power would be a good idea. I wish you well.
I’m lucky I was educated a while back. Before sex education included “have a look at your bits and if you fancy a change send us an email”.
😂🤣😂Lmfao! Oops.
we have the highest percentage of university graduates as a proportion of our population in Europe. Dunoon Grammar is awarded the best Community High School in the World and Port Ellen Primary School voted the best primary school in the U.K.
It’s comments like this that show as ‘one of the warriors’. In this case for the SNP.
‘best in the world’ alone says it all, but you then provide no proof.. And a quick search turns up nothing to back it up.
Also, the use of very specific examples that most people are going to have no clue about is a Debating Technique for Dummies level argument.
suggest you check Eurostat (2022) “Population by education attainment level”
re Port Ellen PS check Pearson National Testing Awards
Dunoon Grammar won ‘Best Community Collaboration’ award. That has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the education; rather that they ‘collaborated’ (see the clue was in the name) in the community.
RU suggesting that education attainment has nothing to do with the ability to collaborate in a meaningful way
I’m not suggesting anything. I am stating that ‘community collaboration’ (which does not mean anything) has nothing to do with educational attainment. You can spin the award as you like; Scottish education has fallen when compared internationally. Our PISA scores have all decreased since devolution while England have remained steady.
Reading 526 (2000) / 504 (2018)
Maths 524 (2003) / 489 (2018)
Science 515 (2006) / 490 (2018)
These figures are from the Scottish Government website!
it obviously means something or schools all over the world wouldn’t take part in it. PISA does not measure outcomes such as employment and positive destinations following completion of formal education.
The proportion of graduates is everything to do with the previous 50 years and very little to do with the last ten years.
have you not been aware of the huge increase in the percentage of the population who now go on to tertiary education in the last twenty years?
You mention university graduates in your original post; but this now becomes tertiary education. Which one is it?
Attending tertiary education and attaining a university degree are again not the same thing.
This sort of conflation is what is wrong with so much of politics today.
but universities are a part of tertiary education, and as part of it they have seen a considerable increase in admissions. i think you should get out more
The typical SNP supporter never takes long to descend to insults. I shall therefore take my leave and not bandy insults with you.
I’m aware of the “encourage the working” class reforms from the goons in the SNP Government that in practice tilted the system towards the middle class.
Probably the most accurate assessment of those at the helm in Paradise ( not that part of Glasgow I mean our land in general ) came from an MP who said of his party back up the road if they were ordering a pizza they would first set up a committee to discuss how to go about it then create a working group before putting it out to public consultation with the end result being it would be 3 times as expensive and take twice as long to deliver …..😂
this formula applies to everything those useless politicians get involved in.
aye welcome to Scotland 2023
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The reason we had a high proportion was pre brexit we had Students studying from EU countries and Scotland getting free education. A pre Covid had a huge percentage of Chinese students be educated with support from their government. Neither case applies anymore.
if the SNP doesn’t govern why has it won 8 elections on the trot?
Because the opposition are even worse, but that doesn’t say much.
Haha! Unfortunately we Brits south of the border only have the ‘even worse’ to vote for! 😆
i rather think it says a lot.
In the Land of the blind the one eyed man is King. It will be an interesting SNP leadership election, ultra Liberalism / Wokism vs A very common sense but old fashioned approach to honesty vs I’m not sure yet.
What I find a bit odd is where have the Old Guard gone ?
I’m not a Nationalist but I am a Patriot and a Unionist, but if I had a vote I’d go for Kate Forbes. She is raw, honest, recognises the issues her beliefs cause but isn’t afraid to deal with those. I like that, as it is really what being a Scot is about,
some definition of patriotism patriot being ruled by another nation
Simple I am a proud Scot, I love my home country, I am a Unionist and I am a European.
I have served to defend all of these, I know who I trusted to watch my back and stick with me. I don’t deny anyone’s right to disagree with me, in fact I defend their right to do so.
I just think we are all stronger together, but we just haven’t worked it all out yet,
And I expect you to respect my right to disagree with you.
As for the Patriotism / Nation of which you speak I struggle with that one. We have a country where only a tiny marginalised minority can speak its native language and has no intent to address that.
Very few of our SNP leaders can say anything except to speak, shout and argue except to do so in another Nations Tongue.
We celebrate Robert De Bruce as our greatest King and he was 100% of Norman decent, our greatest Bard wrote some of the most Beautiful Poems in the English Language.
But as a people what we have contributed to the whole is immeasurable,
Fully agree, we are British and would love to see the union strengthened not weakened. Scotland is part of our woven fabric and I feel pride for the Scots as I do for my own part of the union, Yorkshire, of which has a population exactly the same as Scotland and it’s own unique accent and culture. Once Scotland was in the union nothing could stop Britain (good or bad).
You’re far too generous, George!
Even though people still have political beliefs, it makes it even worse when listening to politicians and having party loyalty. Partly loyalty is dangerous.
Someone said to me that politian’s are like farmers at farmer market selling their wares. The last election was like to 2 bad farmers selling rotten produce we had to choose the least worst option. But there are some people who love rotten produce aka party loyalists, no matter how bad the taste they lap it up and promote it as the best thing you’ll even taste!!! The rest of us want decent farmer to show up.
Sadly same rotten produce when it comes to politics around defence next election
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In the case of the last U.K. general election it was a case of of the indigestible vs the completely inedible.
Labour completely blew it, no radical, left wing, privileged, CND, tree hugging leader has ever got past a general,election. See Foot and Corbyn for details.
Regardless of how appealing the opposition has been.
There should be a big sign put up to future candidates. Mrs Thatcher and Boris Johnson both won because we tried to foist this on the voters. SO DO NOT DO IT.
You are a hero George. My brush with Nationalists was a dialogue of the deaf. It is however, very much more rewarding to look at the strides in ship building for our navy being made today; for the industry in Scotland, re-skilling a work force and trainees. The world we thought and hoped was ours has vanished; now we need to ensure we have the means to defend ourselves and aid our allies. The Royal Navy is crucial to that.
I think G has the constitution of a turnip left in the ground all winter.
BAE systems are building the new mega shed at Govan to build the ships indoors as the Polish tradesmen they have been trying to employ refused to work outside in inclement weather. By 2030 Poland wil have overtaken the U.K. in quality of life. For U.K. read Carthage!
Carthage is a step up. Usually these predictions of catastrophic decline and fall chose somewhere really unpleasant. Poland’s hard headed approach to mass immigration that shield’s its people and economy is a lesson we should learn.
Well this echo chamber is off and running with the red meat to the usual suspects. Good work George, sure it was the whole of point of you posting this or a very similar article…yet again.
I know it’s hypocritical and pretentious to say this, but there are an awful lot of idiots online.
Add in the trolls and shills, and many forums/comments sections are just pointless and unusable. The BBC News comments sections are the worst.
Even here we have Johnsky and friends.
do I love a bit of BBC news comments if I fancy laugh….it’s sort of like a real life version of East Enders…..makes you feel better that your life/views are not all that bad. Getting into the troll fest which is BBC comments is…….ummm life affirming…..I’ll get my coat.
The mainstream press in order to attract clicks also has is devoid of responsibility and an enabler of these echo chambers, the amount of times it presents a headline that whilst factual its the wrong fact. At times it will at some point in the article address the fact that’s relevant, which I guess they believe removes any blame for miss reporting. But people vary rarely read beyond the headlines and its the headlines that get shared.
It’s worth pointing out in this context that the entire Scottish media, TV and Press is one huge Unionist echo chamber.
The ‘fake news’ ferry crisis is a classic example. We are all told there is a ferry criisis. . . . . . but does anyone look at the route capacity figures?
The isle of Arran is supposed to be in crisis. It has 10 sailings a day, a 1,000 car capacity and a population of 5,000.
Shetland has a population of 23,000 2 sailings a day and daily route capacity of about 300 is never in crisis and never mentioned in the media.
If you count the numbers up, and they are readily available, its apparent that the Calmac routes have significant over capacity compared to the Serco run Orkney and Shetland routes, but we are continually told they are ‘in crisis’
A large section of the Scottish publc, with a fair degree of evidence, have come to the conclusion that the entire Scottish media is lying to them, which is why they believe no Frigates are being built.
Hmmm… two sailings a day for Shetland is a bit misleading. A boat arrives each morning and then leaves again in the evening. Providing the weather is OK!
Surely there are two issues which should not be mixed up – firstly facts and secondly opinion. Democracy, which has served us well, allows people to make all sorts of decisions based purely upon their individual opinion. There can be as many opinions as there are people. Ensuring as many people as possible have access to the facts is where mainstream & social media could help. The reality however is that competing opinions swirl around with perhaps too little focus of exposing people to the truth. More truth and facts might well lead to more informed opinions & better decisions in the digital world of tomorrow.