Nigel Farage’s Claims on NATO and Russia’s Invasion of Ukraine.

Nigel Farage, leader of Reform UK, recently asserted that NATO and the EU’s eastward expansion provoked Russia into invading Ukraine.

He argues that this expansion provided Russian President Vladimir Putin with a pretext for aggression. However, this claim is inconsistent with Farage’s long-advertised views on national sovereignty.


This article is the opinion of the author and not necessarily that of the UK Defence Journal. If you would like to submit your own article on this topic or any other, please see our submission guidelines.


Farage argues that the expansion of NATO and the EU into Eastern Europe provoked Russia, giving Putin an excuse to invade Ukraine. He contends that this expansion threatened Russia, prompting defensive actions.

Analysis

1. Sovereign Right to Self-Determination

Farage has consistently advocated for national sovereignty, emphasising that nations should have the right to self-determination. NATO and EU expansions are outcomes of sovereign countries exercising this right. Eastern European nations, such as Poland, the Baltic States, and Ukraine, sought membership in these alliances to enhance their security and economic prosperity.

By suggesting that NATO and EU expansion provoked Russia, Farage contradicts his principle that nations should freely choose their paths. His argument implies that these countries should have limited their sovereign decisions based on Russian preferences, undermining their autonomy and right to self-determination.

2. Security Concerns of Eastern European Nations

Countries in Eastern Europe have pursued NATO and EU membership to protect their sovereignty against potential Russian aggression. Historical experiences, including Soviet occupation, have made these nations wary of Russian intentions. Their decisions to join NATO and the EU are rooted in legitimate security concerns and aspirations for stable governance and economic development.

Farage’s position fails to acknowledge these nations’ rights to seek alliances that ensure their security. Blaming NATO and the EU for provoking Russia disregards the legitimate security needs and sovereign choices of Eastern European countries.

3. Contradiction with National Sovereignty

Farage’s stance that NATO and EU expansion provoked Russia fundamentally contradicts his advertised views on national sovereignty. If nations like the UK should have the right to leave the EU based on sovereignty (as he argued for Brexit), then nations like Ukraine should equally have the right to join alliances like NATO and the EU.

By suggesting that these expansions were provocative, Farage implicitly undermines the principle of national sovereignty he so vocally supports. It suggests that Eastern European countries should not have the freedom to make decisions that best serve their interests, which is inconsistent with his sovereignty advocacy.

4. Putin’s Policies

Many analysts argue that Putin’s actions are driven more by a desire to restore Russia’s sphere of influence and challenge the post-Cold War order than by defensive concerns. The invasion of Ukraine fits into a broader pattern of aggressive policies aimed at destabilising and exerting control over neighbouring regions.

Farage’s argument that NATO and the EU provoked Russia oversimplifies the situation and ignores Russia’s broader strategic goals. It overlooks the fact that Putin’s expansionist tendencies existed independently of NATO’s actions, as evidenced by Russia’s invasion of Georgia in 2008 and the annexation of Crimea in 2014.

5. Support

Farage’s comments have been widely condemned across the political spectrum in the UK. Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, Labour leader Keir Starmer, and other prominent politicians have criticised his stance, emphasising that Russia is the aggressor and that NATO is a defensive alliance.

Christopher Steele, a former intelligence officer who ran the Russia desk at MI6, has also questioned Farage’s ability to defend Britain following his comments. Steele stated that NATO is fundamentally important to Britain’s defence and that Farage’s stance threatens Britain’s security. He accused Farage of “spouting the speaking lines of our adversaries in Moscow,” highlighting how Farage’s comments align with Russian propaganda.

The broad political condemnation underscores the consensus that blaming the West for Russia’s actions is misguided and harmful. It reinforces the view that Farage’s claims do not align with the broader understanding of the conflict’s dynamics.

Get to the point

Nigel Farage’s claim that NATO and EU expansion provoked Russia into invading Ukraine is inconsistent with his long-held views on national sovereignty and fails to recognise the legitimate security concerns of Eastern European nations. His argument contradicts the principle that nations should have the right to freely choose their alliances and overlooks Russia’s broader strategic goals and expansionist policies.

The widespread political condemnation of Farage’s stance further highlights the flawed nature of his argument. Farage’s position not only undermines the sovereignty of Eastern European countries but also misrepresents the complex geopolitical realities at play.

Additionally, Farage’s argument can be considered amateurish because it oversimplifies the complex geopolitical landscape, fails to align with established expert analysis, contradicts his own principles on national sovereignty, and has been widely discredited by mainstream political opinion.

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George has a degree in Cyber Security from Glasgow Caledonian University and has a keen interest in naval and cyber security matters and has appeared on national radio and television to discuss current events. George is on Twitter at @geoallison
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Colin Brooks
Colin Brooks (@guest_828737)
17 days ago

This article is utter rubbish. Farage did not justify Russia’s actions he simply gave his opinions as to their their reasoning. Farage did not suggest that Ukraine did not have the Sovereign right to defend and stand up for its right to exist.
In my opinion what Farage said was a statement of the bleeding obvious!

GlynH
GlynH (@guest_828781)
17 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

George, with high respect, the points you highlight are sound and cohesive; I do & don’t disagree. I watched that interview live and didn’t come away feeling like Nigel was a Pro-Kremlin goon. To all, not just George :/ The collapse of the USSR, was a national embarrassment for Russia and its “socialist states”. States from Estonia in counter clockwise motion flocked to the West. Hell, only the Balkans are being held up by Serbia and . . lets not go there . . Is this Putin’s war YES; is this the Kremlin’s war YES. I want 3% GDP for… Read more »

Andrew D
Andrew D (@guest_828941)
17 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

👍

Colin Brooks
Colin Brooks (@guest_828978)
17 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Well said sir.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_828984)
16 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

Seconded.

ABCRodney
ABCRodney (@guest_829041)
16 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

I pretty well agree with you but I think Farage has misinterpreted the facts, over simplified and shot himself in both feet. Nothing unusual with any of that as he is a Politician and all publicity is good publicity. I do not think for a single second NATO ever intended to “Provoke” Putin, far from it they were convinced that we had everlasting Peace and Russia was a spent penny and was slowly Westernising. IMHO they were Naive, deluded, distespectful and just plain ignorant about Russian History, that’s how I would describe NATO, EU and Western actions and attitudes in… Read more »

Cj
Cj (@guest_829531)
14 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Thanks for that, interesting seeing from both sides my history isn’t great keep forgetting the bloody stuff.

Barry Larking
Barry Larking (@guest_829639)
14 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Excellent Rodders. 👍

Tams
Tams (@guest_829895)
13 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Yes, that is all Russia’s reasoning.

But at the end of the day, they invaded Georgia and Ukraine, internally brutally suppressed opposition (likely faking or encouraging terrorism), have fuelled external conflicts even more than the US, and are propping up utterly nasty regimes like North Korea and the junta in Myanmar.

Actions speak louder than words and have actual real world consequences.

George
George (@guest_831633)
7 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Very well said. We really must have a few beers sometime and solve the worlds problems before last orders. Optional lock-in at the landlords discursion. Just one thing to add to your excellent well presented assessment. As briefly as possible. Western democracies function from election to election. Short term objectives to win power with even shorter term memories. That includes the political will behind NATO and increasingly more political based yes men on the general staff. Resulting in no long-term aims or plans. It is western style democracies greatest weakness. Contrast that with who we consider our primary adversaries. As… Read more »

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829129)
16 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

“But as an historian the moves eastward after 1991 by EU and NATO . . just take second and put yourselves in Moscow’s shoes.”
And?

Concerned
Concerned (@guest_829134)
16 days ago
Reply to  Tomartyr

That Russia would move on from the Cold War and u-turn on its position on NATO? In fact part of Gorbachev’s deal for the reunification of Germany was for no further expansion East.

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829155)
16 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

and?
Still waiting to see how this is anything but Farage justifying Putin’s war.

Last edited 16 days ago by Tomartyr
BigH1979
BigH1979 (@guest_829402)
15 days ago
Reply to  Tomartyr

Seriously mate can you not see it?

‘Someone is doing a bad thing. How can i understand why are they doing the bad thing? Maybe i can try and see it from their point of view?’

Did you know its a really good social skill to have and can really improve your life.

Shaun
Shaun (@guest_829435)
14 days ago
Reply to  BigH1979

See what, that poo tin launched an unjustifiable, genocidal attack on a peaceful neighbour on the justification that they might (in 2022 there was zero chance of Ukraine joining NATO due to the internal conflict created by poo tin) join the bugaboo purely defensive alliance. If that were truly the case what about Sweden and Finland? In reality Poo tin has flip flopped from one utterly ludicrous justification to another, NATO is just another distraction from his real intentions.

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829452)
14 days ago
Reply to  BigH1979

The reason why they are doing the bad thing is because they have a poor grip on reality and can’t cope with the fact that the Russian Empire is dead and buried.

The logical outcome of seeing a defensive alliance, that you can’t even hope to fight, on your border is starting less wars of aggression not more.

Dern
Dern (@guest_829210)
16 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

Seeing a bit of a pattern here…
BTW that was never a deal. It’s just something Putin says and hopes people will believe.

Concerned
Concerned (@guest_829245)
15 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Whether it was part of the deal is a different question but it was what Gorbachev told the Russian people for why he accepted the deal

Dern
Dern (@guest_829271)
15 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

So the West is to blame because Gorbachev (who by the way has repeatedly gone back and forth on what he claims happened) Lied?

That’s one of the dumbest vatnik arguments I’ve heard yet, and they tend to be pretty stupid.

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829347)
15 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Will said Dern. 🙏

Shaun
Shaun (@guest_829436)
14 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Agreed.

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829595)
14 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Chortle. So true Dern. Well said

Concerned
Concerned (@guest_829248)
15 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Its not something he hopes they believes, they will believe it. This is propaganda they have been fed for their whole lives and you expect them to see through it and have the same view of NATO that we do?

Dern
Dern (@guest_829272)
15 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

Oh so every person on the planet believes it does it? Guess I’m not a person then. Get a grip, Putin hopes people will believe his lies, some do, many don’t.

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829455)
14 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

ok so in your version of events Putin was unwillingly swept along by the Russian public’s jingoistic fervour?

Poor Putin, truly he’s the victim here..

Last edited 14 days ago by Tomartyr
Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829453)
14 days ago
Reply to  Dern

mad that people can’t tell the difference between an informal agreement with a dead country and an actual treaty

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829599)
14 days ago
Reply to  Tomartyr

It was a written agreement between W. Germany and the former USSR, in Sept. 1990, but rather a limited one applying only to the former territory of DDR for the duration of the Soviet troops remaining there. It included a rehousing deal of Soviet troops returning back to Russia.
No grand agreement between USSR and NATO.

Last edited 14 days ago by Meirion X
Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829594)
14 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Yep. He’s taken a page out of Trumps playbook. Keep repeating inaccuracies or lies dress them up as truths, state these lies so frequently and widely enough through as many routes into his target audiences subconscious that they start to believe said lies are truths.
Classic Trump.

Big K
Big K (@guest_829757)
13 days ago
Reply to  Mr Bell

But you believe Steele, Killery’s Russia Russia Russia Intel report which has proven to be a load!!! Iĺ see they have TDS here also!

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829325)
15 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

“…In fact part of Gorbachev’s deal for the reunification of Germany was for no further expansion East…”

That deal only applied to the area of the former GDR(East Germany). There was still Soviet troops there in 1990. Germany certainly did not want U.S or BAOR to come into close contact with the Soviet troops there, while still on German soil.
I think it took about 4 years until 1994 to rehouse them all back to Russia. Germany had to pay the cost to rehouse. There are now Bundeswehr in the Eastern Lander of Germany which is a NATO member.

Last edited 15 days ago by Meirion X
Dern
Dern (@guest_829338)
15 days ago
Reply to  Meirion X

Would have been hard not to post Bundeswehr into the former DDR as the Nationale Volksarmee became part of the Bundeswehr on unification.

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829339)
15 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Yes, that is correct. But they certainly did not want Western foreign troops there, while the Soviet troops were still there, which became Russian troops in 1992. It did not matter after 1994.
The U.S Army had their bases in the South, the British in the West.

Last edited 15 days ago by Meirion X
Dern
Dern (@guest_829628)
14 days ago
Reply to  Meirion X

Eeeeehhhh, I want to emphasise just how small a part of NATO the BAOR was (even the American presence was surprisingly small before a Reforger took place; After someone spouted off about how Germany did nothing but sit back and let America and the UK protect them during the cold war, I made this; and it’s notable how few Union Jacks are in the Orbat. https ://i.imgur.c om/WX6RprF.jpeg (as usual remove the spaces to access the link). For reference, the BAOR held about 1/4 of NORTHAG’s front, and NORTHAG only stretched from Hamburg to Kassel. (And yes there should be… Read more »

Shaun
Shaun (@guest_829433)
14 days ago
Reply to  Concerned

The purported agreement that NATO wouldn’t accept any ex-Warsaw pact countries is undoubtedly a russian talking point but one I have never seen any hard evidence to back up. In what treaty was it stipulated and were the Sovereign states so disadvantaged ever consulted? They are sovereign and as such are entitled to make their own decisions and I am sorry but poo tin nor his country has the right to dictate to them.

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829646)
14 days ago
Reply to  Shaun

Also Russia signed the 1997 NATO-Russia Foundation Act, in which It was no longer considered as an enemy from that point, as a prelude to ex Warpack countries joining in 1999.
So agreed to that process!
.

Paul T
Paul T (@guest_829840)
13 days ago
Reply to  Shaun
Andy P
Andy P (@guest_829314)
15 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

I’m a bit late to the party GlynH but……. “I’m totally pro England, UK & NATO, before the barrage of verbal abuse sets in. Just my thoughts on a relationship between West & East that started in 1917.” This tells a story. I have no doubt you are pro “England etc” but that’s coming from a very selfish perspective. It screams “as long as I’m alright Jack”. Why shouldn’t the Ukrainians, Poles etc have the same rights as ‘us’ to both run their countries the way they want and also to forge alliances that they want. That seems to be… Read more »

GlynH
GlynH (@guest_829318)
15 days ago
Reply to  Andy P

You are misunderstanding me in your 3rd paragraph. Look, I’ve seen plenty of “odd” posters on his site for years. I was simply saying I’m not a Russian puppet etc.

Andy P
Andy P (@guest_829334)
15 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

No, I totally get where you were coming from, you were getting your bonafides out there. My point is that its a selfish perspective (sorry) to suggest that Ukraine should just accept their lot as being Russia adjacent and be a buffer state. The Ukrainians (Poles, Estonians etc) have the same rights as us to be in charge of their destinies, to write them off as basically pawns because of their geography is pretty crass (again, apologies if I offend). The UK have joined and left the EU because ‘we’ chose to, why shouldn’t Ukraine ? A different argument could… Read more »

GlynH
GlynH (@guest_829802)
13 days ago
Reply to  Andy P

I’m confused where Ukraine entered into my original statement. The ex-eastern block states can do as they choose, as you say. Wanna go west great. Wanna go east…ooooo sorry about that. Hell I’d like Belarus to drop that dipshit president and join up to NATO. Can U imagine the Kremlin on that one. Yikes

Andy P
Andy P (@guest_829837)
13 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Have you edited your post ? I seem to mind it being a bit more one sided. Anyhoo… even if you didn’t mention Ukraine, you responded to a pretty binary post with a “I agree and disagree” or words to that effect. We can dive down a “Naw I didn’t mean THAT” kind of debate but there’s no point.

geoff
geoff (@guest_829561)
14 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Hi GlynH. We can agree to disagree. The British lost their Empire relatively gracefully and forged a relationship, generally on good terms with the Commonwealth that suceeded it. Can you imagine the UK invading the Republic of Ireland, or if for example,Scotland were to opt for Independence, bombing Edinburgh killing thousands of Scottish civilians? Picture that and dwell on it. Therein lies the crucial difference.

GlynH
GlynH (@guest_829807)
13 days ago
Reply to  geoff

did I post in an alternative reality. Where did Ireland and Scotland come from in my put original post.

geoff
geoff (@guest_829897)
13 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Morning Glyn. I was just trying to make a point and put a context on the issue to no one in particular. Russia and Ukraine were family-they gave the USSR two of its most prominent Presidents. So they had differences political and social, which got to the stage where Russia felt justified enough to attack her erstwhile cousin, killing its people indiscriminately and reducing cities and infrastructure to rubble. Now compare the UK to barbarous Russia. If the SNP were ever to achieve Scottish independence, can you imagine any circumstance in which England would want to inflict such harm on… Read more »

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829589)
14 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

The Balkans are thriving, Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia are all developing nations with huge potential. They are not being “held up” by Serbia. Quite the opposite Serbia are seen and felt to be an unstable element of aggressive, war like nation that wants to subjugate it’s neighbours.

GlynH
GlynH (@guest_829806)
13 days ago
Reply to  Mr Bell

Yep that’s what I said.

Barry Larking
Barry Larking (@guest_829637)
14 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Correct. Putin is a not very bright thug but the headlong moves to include Ukraine into the European Union and N.A.T.O. were ill advised. International relations are not for the impulsive. We should be mindful that the appalling collapse of post 1989-90 U.S.S.R. in 1999 was a catastrophe for all Russians bar the oligarchs in London and humiliating to a proud nation; how would we feel? This in no way endorses or excuses Putins reckless adventurism. Responsible people don’t feed a fire that has gone out of control. I hope my own record (but nowhere near as good or funny… Read more »

Marius
Marius (@guest_829673)
13 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Clearly explained and thank you for doing so. The ailing Soviet bear was continuously poked since the collapse of 1990 . . .
The ‘West’ had the ideal opportunity to stop Putin in 2014 in the Crimea, both Obama and Cameron sat on their laurels doing nothing.
The modern day version of Munich 1938 is now playing out.

George
George (@guest_831632)
7 days ago
Reply to  GlynH

Very well said. As a historian you will be aware of the dubious and changing roles Ukrainian “refugees” played during WWII. Then in the hazardous Cold War espionage games that followed for the West/NATO. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. SS tattoos and pending war crime charges notwithstanding. It’s a very murky piece of modern history that has yet to be fully revealed. Nobody comes out of that chapter of history smelling of roses. It’s the nature of the beast. The defeat of the USSR and Warsaw Pact was no accident. 2014 and the overthrow of a pro-Russian… Read more »

Andrew D
Andrew D (@guest_828940)
17 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

Morning George ,Farage did say in the intview that it was Putin’s fault and pointed at the picture of Putin.There’s no doubt in my mind Putin didn’t like the growth of NATO or the EU.Anything to do with the West is bad in Putin’s mind .Sure Farage doesn’t agree with war.I hope Ukraine gets peace and for Putin to lose everything .How he sleeps at night killing incense women and children and even is own troops is beyond me.👍

Jack
Jack (@guest_829422)
14 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

I hope this website isn’t going to become yet another Farage bashing platform for the whole run up to the election.

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829598)
14 days ago
Reply to  Jack

It’s not Farage bashing it’s arguing against lies, untruths and presenting the facts.
Farage , who seems to have a loyal following behind him, needs to appreciate that what he says is noted , recorded and analysed as is the case for all senior political party leadership
Farage has thrown his hat into the political ring. That means he has a responsibility now to go on record, tell the truth and expect to be called out when he is talking out his arse.

grizzler
grizzler (@guest_829841)
13 days ago
Reply to  Jack

If it does count me in – he’s a complete *&$! (insert whatever word you want ) ..I suppose Mosley was only telling it how was as well then.
How anyone can truly believe Farage & his Reform apologists have the interests of the UK it heart is quite simply beyond me.
You are being manipulated by the master puppeteer himself.

Christopher
Christopher (@guest_829431)
14 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

Sorry George, I am with Colin on this. Farage was indeed stating the bleeding obvious, further more, I am not entirely sure how our national self interest is improved if we beggar Putin too much, are we not we really just strengthening the Chinese hand?

geoff
geoff (@guest_829560)
14 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

Well said George.In simple terms, there was no justification whatsoever for the dictator Putin to invade Ukraine. This barbarous action has cost the lives of thousands of men,women and children on both sides of the border and brought the whole world to the edge of Armageddon. We should be in absolutely no doubt as to who are the evil agents in this conflict, despite the attempts of people like Farage to muddy the waters.

JOHN MELLING
JOHN MELLING (@guest_829816)
13 days ago
Reply to  George Allison

Well said George👍

Andrew Robinson
Andrew Robinson (@guest_828746)
17 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

The ‘west’ is in the middle of an existential fight for its existence….long term, I dont believe its hyperbole to say that This is not about Brexit or immigration numbers or whatever….the man has shown, through his comments about Ukraine or his defence of Trumps assault on democratic norms, that he is a dangerous threat to our lives…..

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_828998)
16 days ago

Hyperbole.
He’s wrong on Trump, he’s wrong on his environmental views. And he’s spot on with many other things by my book.
Par the course with any one in life, not everyone has the same view or agrees on all things.
He’s no more a “dangerous threat to our lives” than the sitting politicians in both main parties who have allowed in unlimited numbers of “refugees” unchecked, several of whom have gone on to blow people up.
Which he, and many millions who agree with him, wish to reduce.

ABCRodney
ABCRodney (@guest_829045)
16 days ago

Hi M8 Happy Sunday. I was a 100% Reform vote till he got involved and I just can’t back anyone who can’t see anything wrong with Tango Man Trump. That’s right out there with the Flat Earth Society and the rabid branch of the SNP. Which is very sad for me because I happen to live in Reform Central and have personally known and liked our local reform candidate since college in 1979. UK Politics right now are probably about to give us a period of quiet stability, I genuinely hope Labour have learnt their lesson and will not do… Read more »

Wasp snorter
Wasp snorter (@guest_829058)
16 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Agreed, I simply cannot trust someone who is so pro Trump and is also a closet ‘man made’ climate denier. His ‘contract’ manifesto isn’t unreasonable and he has a knack of voicing issues that need to be talked about, but he’s too much for me.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829081)
16 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

It is the yearly increase in population, ongoing, that is the problem mate, not just the illegals. There are too many people in this country for the infrastructure we have. And virtually none are removed. That, added to an ageing population, is the problem. Even my Dad agrees. And he was an immigrant who came here in 1962. Except he wasn’t allowed to land unless he had a job lined up. It is a ticking time bomb that will only get worse as, like the NHS, it’s too hot a potato for any politician to handle as “race” is instantly… Read more »

ABCRodney
ABCRodney (@guest_829198)
16 days ago

I don’t disagree with you about the seemingly invisible effect of “legal” migration. It’s a subject none of the main parties mention, they are fixated by the 40k pa illegals in rubber boats. I think it has a lot to do with the cosy ££££ led relationships between the political Hierarchy and Universities. Over the last 30 years the number of Universities in U.K. has become a major industry and source of income (for some). Way too many foreign students admitted all then bringing in their dependants, and most are on non useful courses. Yes I do suspect that the… Read more »

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829200)
16 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Morning mate. Good point re ID cards. Though I also remember the backlash from the human rights lobby. Students are but a part of it. What of dependents of economic migrants, like everyone’s granny and 5th auntie and uncle allowed to follow? So one becomes 6. Is that the “right to a family life” I keep reading about? Is that actually a thing? I recall the UK population was around 56 million, or thereabouts, for a long time, in my childhood and into young adulthood. What is it now, not sure, 65 million, or more? Where is all the additional… Read more »

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829348)
15 days ago

great commentary DM- Spot on Mate!👌

geoff
geoff (@guest_829563)
14 days ago
Reply to  klonkie

Morning Klonkie and Daniele. At the risk of sounding like a runner with the hounds etc. I am with you 100% on the immigration issue. Allowing people to simply arrive on the Dover beaches is an outrage, but for me Putin is evil personified and the invasion of Ukraine is an unforgivable crime against us all.
Cheers from Durbs

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829565)
14 days ago
Reply to  geoff

Hi Geoff. I have empathy for the folk who actually do have a legitimate reason for asylum or war refugees. Because of the afforded mob, these illegal immigrants jump the queue.

High time China stepped up and take a million of these people considering they keep complaining that their population is falling.

geoff
geoff (@guest_829578)
14 days ago
Reply to  klonkie

100% Klonkie. I remember as a little boy in London 1950’s Mrs Kosiba from eastern Europe who came to London as a WW2 refugee and always said she was so grateful to the British people who took her in basically saved her life. Then there was the Hungarian refugees who had faced down Russian tanks with Molotovs and side arms in 1956 who poured into London. The one man was a barber and I remember him cutting my seven year old hair and telling me stories with a booming laugh in his broken English. Now we have people from the… Read more »

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829923)
13 days ago
Reply to  geoff

Great commentary Mate – well written

geoff
geoff (@guest_829952)
13 days ago
Reply to  klonkie

Thanks Klonkie

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829600)
14 days ago
Reply to  klonkie

Good point. China has a huge surplus of housing they could easily house 250 million migrants. Although who wants to live in a communist dictatorship?

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829932)
13 days ago
Reply to  Mr Bell

Point taken re Commies, but they are part of the UN and need to shoulder the burden. The same applies to Japan that has a falling population with 3rd largest global economy. Send ’em there.

Be nice to see Asian countries embrace diversity and inclusion (sarcastic comment ends- apologies).

Middle Eastern oil states should take in Muslim illegal immigrants .They employ Indian migrant labour to undertake their construction infrastructure projects. I can see no reason why Muslim refugees would not see this as a better standard of living vs what they claim to be fleeing from.

grizzler
grizzler (@guest_829843)
13 days ago
Reply to  klonkie

China -??!! Jesus Christ….OK.

klonkie
klonkie (@guest_829927)
13 days ago
Reply to  grizzler

Well, how come the western UN Nations have to shoulder this burden? China contributes squat and Japan is a close second (the 2nd and 3rd largest global economies).

When last did a Muslim Middle East oil nation take in their fare share? You can see the picture that’s being formed.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829651)
14 days ago
Reply to  geoff

He is, geoff. No question, UKR has the right to defend itself and form whatever alliances it wants.
I see I’ve already earned an “FSB” slur against me this morning on the EoD para thread, just for having a different view on this and Farage.

Playground stuff, truly. I even use my real name here, unlike just about every one else.

geoff
geoff (@guest_829682)
13 days ago

Hello Daniele. I try not to be a fossil but I only do Wasup and selected sites such as UKDJ. I have been tempted to join Facebook (my Grandkids laugh when I say Facebook) because some of my sport stuff is there but then I hear of stories such as yours and worse so I shy away! Disgraceful that you or anyone has to be subject to the posts of morons. The UKDJ, apart from the odd event is a site for adults to exchange views on the subject we love. I have no problem with differing opinions-none of us… Read more »

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829687)
13 days ago
Reply to  geoff

Wasup?? You mean whatsApp? You’re not much lower than me to be fair! I’m not into all the tech stuff either, and I’m a good bit younger than you my friend. Yep, agree. I may well be wrong on my take of Farage on this particular issue. Sure, if so, I can accept that. Misguided? Sure, throw that at me. But an FSB mole, like I’m some deep cover red under the F’ing bed after all this time posting here?! I don’t even know any Russians! Well, all you lot. Look me up, come and have a pint with me,… Read more »

geoff
geoff (@guest_829900)
13 days ago

Hello Daniele. Maybe I should join Facebook and catch up with you properly. Wasup is just a local tag of whatsApp coined by a canoeing friend of ours. Don’t apologise for giving an opinion Daniele-exchanging thoughts and ideas on UKDJ gives us a wider view of our world. Maybe i have missed something with regards to Russia, and Farage is not all bad-even Trump has some ideas that don’t offend. Also, with the new age of social media, we have to put up with some morons on the fringes so don’t take personally (what’s an FSB btw?) You and I… Read more »

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829915)
13 days ago
Reply to  geoff

Ha! geoff, we most certainly do. My cat ( who I inherited from mum when she died ) does that, at 3am! I have to isolate him elsewhere in mums bungalow till he goes out at 6. You should, mate. Look me up on FB, which also has messenger, so one can post direct like WhatsApp. There are other profiles on there with an identical name, but I’m easy to find. I’m the one with a baby Starling sitting on my head! One of many we’ve raised. Your wildlife activities sound fantastic, would defo take you up on that. Original… Read more »

geoff
geoff (@guest_829955)
13 days ago

Original Art-from Jans Uncles 😄 One was quite famous locally-Andrew Verster was his name. He did commissions for the ANC😁 The other was also fairly well known here Aidan Walsh.

Jonny
Jonny (@guest_829487)
14 days ago

The right and the far right only pretend to want to lower immigration. Immigration benefits them because big business can undercut British workers with low paid foreign labour. Farage, like the Tories before him, will merely pretend to care and then not do anything to keep his big business lobbyists happy. The priority should be electing a party that wants to solve the core issue which is that the domestic workforce needs to be trained with the relevant skills. A large proportion of straight A* medicine applicants are denied studying medicine because there aren’t the spaces available for them as… Read more »

Jim
Jim (@guest_829306)
15 days ago
Reply to  ABCRodney

Well said

Dern
Dern (@guest_829215)
16 days ago

…going to HARD disagree with the assesment that he’s not a dangerous threat to my life, especially with the Neo-Nazi’s and ex-BNP supporters he’s recruited into his party.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829218)
16 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Fair enough. Did he recruit them or did an agency. Whatever, I’d read they’d all been exposed.

Dern
Dern (@guest_829268)
15 days ago

All the ones that have been exposed have been exposed. Let’s face it, his party was more than happy to have neo-nazi’s in it’s ranks and if it wasn’t for external forces they’d have stayed.

Ultimately he’s a little Putin, and letting him close to power is a mistake that will cost all of us, but especially those of us who are vulnerable.

Hereward
Hereward (@guest_829761)
13 days ago
Reply to  Dern

…going to HARD disagree with the assesment that he’s not a dangerous threat to my life…..

???

Big K
Big K (@guest_829765)
13 days ago
Reply to  Dern

Better find a safe space quickly!!

grizzler
grizzler (@guest_829842)
13 days ago

Sorry Daniele in this instance I believe you are wrong – he is a subversive- I don’t trust a word he bloody says.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829850)
13 days ago
Reply to  grizzler

No worries mate. Respect.

James Fennell
James Fennell (@guest_829128)
16 days ago

Precisely.

Dave Wolfy
Dave Wolfy (@guest_828758)
17 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

Agreed.

DMJ
DMJ (@guest_829397)
15 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

Correct. He made the point that by the West ignoring the Russian annexation of Crimea, it encouraged Putin.
As time has proved, and continues to do so, not least in the language used on the internet.

Barry Larking
Barry Larking (@guest_829633)
14 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

The west is going to have to live with Russia; Putin may not be the worst among them either, daunting as that is to think on. Farage said nothing left leaning friends said to me when the conflict was a few months old. he should however have been mindful how his thoughts could be twisted out of shape if not context. He blames Putin for the war but as we can see, that has been lost to sight.

Marius
Marius (@guest_829667)
14 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

Right you are!

George
George (@guest_831631)
7 days ago
Reply to  Colin Brooks

It shows the true political bias of UKDJ. Jumping on the lame stream media bandwagon. Future career mapping Ahoy. When Farage closes on the target, the flak increases. Remember back in the early 2000’s several geopolitical commentators vociferously warned against NATO and the EU expanding eastwards. But the transient Western politicians did not listen. Even senior military figures expressed the same concerns to intentionally deaf ears. Farage is not the man to let that go. Neither should anyone with a real desire to see the war brought to an end. “Jaw jaw not war war.” Let me know if you… Read more »

JOHN MELLING
JOHN MELLING (@guest_828739)
17 days ago

We had him last night on twitter, I posted straight on his thread seconds later with a meme and the amount of disgust at his outing as a russian asset was clear.

The “russians” even came on in the thread to try and defend him!! 😂

Last edited 17 days ago by JOHN MELLING
Big K
Big K (@guest_829767)
13 days ago
Reply to  JOHN MELLING

You sound just like pencil neck in Washington. That went well for the Democrats! You seem to be another ‘Reds under the beds’ from the 60’s.

Jonny
Jonny (@guest_828743)
17 days ago

Farage showing his true colours… Certain regulars on this site won’t be able to accept that! And the obvious follow up would be if you can accept that Farage is in fact a Putin stooge after all, then what does that say about him being one of the leading voices behind Brexit? Well don’t say I (and millions of others) didn’t warn you…

Dragonwight
Dragonwight (@guest_828845)
17 days ago
Reply to  Jonny

Brexit has nothing to do with it. You know it is possible to agree with someone on one subject and disagree with them on another. Only a drone slavishly believes everything. Farage was right about the EU and he is wrong on this.

Jonny
Jonny (@guest_828857)
17 days ago
Reply to  Dragonwight

It’s a bit naive to think the two are completely unrelated. Don’t you think Putin would do everything in his power to complicate relations in Europe, and here Farage is supporting Putin. Not hard to put two and two together.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829020)
16 days ago
Reply to  Jonny

One could also say it is naive to think that they are. The growing anti Federal EU, not the EU as a trading block of like minded nations which it should be, was growing before Nigel came along.
He just provided a voice, and a spark.
NATO is the bedrock of European security, is that not so.
Now if you were to suggest Putin was pushing a UK break up I would agree.
When the UK left the EU we were still allies, we were still in NATO, we are still European. And always will be.

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829130)
16 days ago
Reply to  Dragonwight

The enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend.

Simon
Simon (@guest_828747)
17 days ago

Not a good time to have this discussion when Russia is attacking Ukraine. Russian threat/pride was underestimated, remember the offer to Russia to join NATO. There were a few American and European visits to Kiev talking about entry. Finland played it better.

D.Roberts
D.Roberts (@guest_828749)
17 days ago
Reply to  Simon

That’s kinda the point of disinformation, to influence political events. Reforms use of bots hasn’t helped

Enoch
Enoch (@guest_828785)
17 days ago

Farage just stated the obvious.

F.frib
F.frib (@guest_828802)
17 days ago

If Mexico decided to host russian nuclear missiles, according to this article the USA should not intervene, since Mexico is a sovereign country.

Richard
Richard (@guest_828826)
17 days ago

I know/disagreed with a very keen UKIPer (prior to 2020). So, I am not surprised by that view being promoted by Reform. They have been of the view that the EU system is a throwback to the USSR, and the issue has been that the EU and USSR systems remove a nation’s responsibility for self-determination. In the case of Ukraine and Russia, Volodymyr Zelenskyy has insisted on joining the EU and also making war on those inside Ukraine who disagree with him, which will lead to further conflict as the EU pressures Ukraine into its system. In their view, Russia… Read more »

Dragonwight
Dragonwight (@guest_828840)
17 days ago

Yep, Farage was spouting Kremlin propaganda. I can only surmise this is part of his friend, Donald Trump’s plan for peace in Ukraine. Just let the Russians have what they want, basically.

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_828847)
17 days ago

NATO and to an extent EU expansion can be laid at the door of one person pootin himself! To have someone running for the HOP to utter such bollocks is frankly quite worrying,If I was in England that statement would have been one of the deciding factors where my cross would go!

Marked
Marked (@guest_828930)
17 days ago

🎅

Last edited 17 days ago by Marked
Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_828932)
17 days ago

Having watched the interview, and met and chatted to the bloke on two occasions, I take a slightly different view. Hillarious the state of politics, it is like kids in the playground. “Look! Look! So and so said that. Shock. Horror!” Then amplify to get desired effect as the mass hysteria sets in. Labour did it over many, many months to help bring down the Tories with their failings as it then sticks in the public consciousness. I’m amazed any politician utters a word for fear of how it will be twisted. I find it delicious how one person’s comment… Read more »

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829199)
16 days ago

Trouble is mate he has come out with this at exactly the same time as trump is going podcasts in the US saying the same thing! Not a good look is it? In the telegraph he said western countries should try to sort out negotiations,look how well that approach has worked out for Ukraine! Like you said on so many things he has it spot on but this has for me blotted his copybook big time.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829201)
16 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

Morning mate. That’s fair enough. I don’t link the two as he’s been warning of the likely Russian retaliation all the way back to 2014 and before.
He made a speech in the European Parliament to that effect years ago,and it has all come to pass.
But agree, if Trumps been on a podcast at the same time people are bound to put 2 and 2 together.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829204)
16 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

On negotiation, isn’t that inevitable anyway?
The recent Russian offers were in effect wanting capitulation, which were rightly rejected out of hand.
Do we really believe UKR will fight for the next 50 years? Or Russia? It will have to stop sometime.

If UKR is not able to militarily eject Russia from the territory it has taken, then what?

And if Russia is not able to prevail, due to the western supply, some say drip feed of arms and tech to give UKR the edge, then what?

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829211)
16 days ago

That’s the question isn’t it how do you stop this and not let the Orcs claiming a win? We all know it’s an excuse to let pootin rearm and have another go,tough questions indeed.

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829229)
16 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

The Russians will claim a win regardless, if they hang on to any part of the territory they’ve occupied.
Pooptin will spin it the way that suits yo the masses.

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829244)
15 days ago

Here’s a theory, he withdraws to 2022 borders gives up Crimea and those oblasts that declared independence from Kiev get a FREE referendum run by the UN as to whether they want to stay with Russia or not that’s people who actually lived there not Russian imports,if they stay Any citizen that doesn’t want to stay is allowed to relocate to Ukraine proper!
not going to happen I know but can you see any other options?

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829247)
15 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

He gives up the Donbass areas that they invaded in 22, but Crimea is given away to Russia.
I only see a way out If both sides have an off ramp with something.
Russia get Crimea, Ukraine gets a barren wasteland, but chance to rebuild, join EU, NATO.

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829273)
15 days ago

I think we are broadly on the same way if thinking👍
O/T have you seen Jake Broe on YouTube he is fairly well over the war?

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_829282)
15 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

No, not heard of him.

GR
GR (@guest_828994)
16 days ago

Regardless of what we think of certain countries and how evil their leaders are. Is he wrong to say that it was a bad idea to provoke such a powerful country? You could make a moral case for invading China and removing the CCP but that does not mean it would be a bad idea that would not end in tears. As it happens, I do believe we have a moral responsibility to help Ukraine, but frankly it makes me sick to see the usual incompetent uniparty leaders grandstanding about what Farage is saying when we and the rest of… Read more »

Daniele Mandelli
Daniele Mandelli (@guest_828999)
16 days ago
Reply to  GR

Bravo.

Patrick
Patrick (@guest_829304)
15 days ago
Reply to  GR

100% agree that the armed forces have been neglected for far too long and the grandstanding by Sunak and the rest of them was pathetic. However, Farage is an utter waste of blood and organs, the fact he said this proves he doesn’t have the mental capacity to be a statesman.

SRamshaw
SRamshaw (@guest_828996)
16 days ago

Farange said it provided Putin with the PRETEXT for the invasion, and IMO he is correct. Add on to that the Wests hand wringing and procrastination when it was obvious what he was planning to do and yes, the West is very culpable in the invasion of the Ukraine.

Jon
Jon (@guest_829126)
16 days ago
Reply to  SRamshaw

Claiming the expansion provided a pretext strongly implies there was an expansion. Except there had been no eastward expansion of NATO for 18 years. Putin needed nothing from NATO for his story. If there had never been an expansion he’d have claimed it was because of NATO’s continued existence. Putin doesn’t let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Paul T
Paul T (@guest_829184)
16 days ago
Reply to  Jon

So the admission of Ukraine into NATO would not constitute an Eastwards Expansion then ?.

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829288)
15 days ago
Reply to  Paul T

No! It will be Ukraine, along with the rest of Eastern Europe, rejecting ruZZian imperial grandeur!

Last edited 15 days ago by Meirion X
Jon
Jon (@guest_829602)
14 days ago
Reply to  Paul T

As would the accession of Kazakhstan, Moldova or Mongolia, but they didn’t join during those 18 years any more than Ukraine. The war caused further NATO eastward expansion. If Ukraine joined NATO in the future it would be because of the war, not a cause of it. Before the annexation of Crimea, Ukraine was neutral and part of the CIS.

It was the issue of joining the EU vs stronger economic ties with Russia that caused Maidan. Putin’s reaction was about money and resources leaving the Russian sphere, not a military threat.

Last edited 14 days ago by Jon
Paul T
Paul T (@guest_829051)
16 days ago
AlbertStarburst
AlbertStarburst (@guest_829065)
16 days ago

…and this is why am struggling to know who to vote for. I am empathetic to so many of Nigel’s points on other subjects (but not Covid or Trump), but I was hoping he had gone on a bit of a journey with Ukraine subject to understand Putin’s mentality and the wider goal or re-establishing the Soviet union. If any of Nigel’s people are reading this thread I strongly urge him to have a conversation with somebody like Ukrainian Denys Davidov, who himself is not found of the EU for Ukraine, but would put Nigel right on Putin’s declared motivations… Read more »

GR
GR (@guest_829311)
15 days ago

Farage has actually said he supports sending munitions to Ukraine. His issue is how we got here.

AlbertStarburst
AlbertStarburst (@guest_829387)
15 days ago
Reply to  GR

OK, that is good, but still the lack of understanding about Putin and his motivations is not right and shows a flaw in Nigel’s character – unless he is able now to look at this again and understand that it is not about what NATO or the EU do or don’t do, but about these former Soviet countries wanting to be free. Ask an Estonian for example.

GR
GR (@guest_829388)
15 days ago

Nobody is perfect and nobody can understand all things, but, no disrespect to Ukraine, there is a lot more going on than just Ukraine and Putin. We have an unchecked rush of mass, illegal immigration, a moribund economy, woke idiocy running unchecked through our institutions and of course, the failure to take defence spending seriously. I have more faith in Reform addressing those concerns, unhampered by pandering to the conceits of the deeply embedded net zero obsessed, virtue signalling middle class liberals than the clowns in conlabour. If we are going to start confronting authoritarian regimes, going to 3% of… Read more »

AlbertStarburst
AlbertStarburst (@guest_829398)
15 days ago
Reply to  GR

Although I agree with much of what you say GR, there is still the point that Nigel’s “world view” over Ukraine and the like, does not seemingly chime with me. If Nigel cannot see that Ukraine and the Baltic’s states desire to free themselves from the Putin jackboot and Russian colonization is not very similar to the WWII Nazi history, then I have a problem. It is more fundamental than “just being about Ukraine.” I hope Nigel can go on a journey and educate himself about this, but I fear it is too late and I am left with nobody… Read more »

GR
GR (@guest_829403)
15 days ago

If you insist in purity and the perfect alignment of a candidate with your beliefs and values, you will always be disappointed and have no one to vote for.

AlbertStarburst
AlbertStarburst (@guest_829406)
15 days ago
Reply to  GR

I’m saying that for me it is a fundamental. Sort of a moral compass thing.

Ian
Ian (@guest_829185)
16 days ago

The fact that countries bordering Russia are completely entitled to seek their own alliances does not mean that Russia won’t find them doing so provocative. These are not mutually exclusive concepts. The fact that Putin does consistently seek to portray NATO as an enemy is why we are compelled to view Russia as an enemy.

Cripes
Cripes (@guest_829208)
16 days ago

Forage is naive and plain wrong on this one. When the USSR disolved itself, the 9 Soviet satellites in eastetn Europe all promptly formed an orderly queue to join both the EU and NATO. The EU, to begin to reverse the decades of poverty, scarcity and oppression created under the Soviet regime. NATO, to ensure that never again would these countries fall under the repressive jackboot of the Russian police state. They remember, we forget, how many hundreds of thousands of opponents and so-called intellectuals were murdered, sent to gulags or forcibly displaced from their homelands and how many hundreds… Read more »

Jonathan
Jonathan (@guest_829214)
16 days ago

What Farage stated was wrong and counter factual….the very specific issue I have is that farage very clearly stated twice in the interview “ we provoked this war”…..and that is wrong…he dressed it in some flowers stating that NATO expansion had given Putin an excuse to his people…but Farage also clearly stated “ we provoked this war”. Others will not agree, but to me that puts him with Corbin and Trump as security risks. Infact the evidence is there that NATO inaction was more impactful than any NATO action. Why was it counterfactual to state “ we provoked this war”… Read more »

English Brigadier
English Brigadier (@guest_829246)
15 days ago

If the mainstream parties had dealt with the issue of immigration then he and his party would not be as popular as they are. With regards to Ukraine, they are going to be in troubled waters if the trend in Europe continues to favour the “far right” or whatever one wants to label them. The far left is also a major problem as far as Ukraine is concerned. Ukraine cannot “win” this war and Russia does not appear to be willing to give up and go home. I fully support Ukraine and its people’s wish to join the EU and… Read more »

Last edited 15 days ago by English Brigadier
Cripes
Cripes (@guest_829254)
15 days ago

There is no sign of Europe abandoning Ukraine, in fact the reverse. Most NATO members are stepping up their financial and equipment contributions.

The odd men out are the odious Orban in Hungary and Trump, if he gets re-elected. The former is of zero importance. If the latter occurs, NATO Europe is going to have to shift up another gear to make up for US backsliding. If so, I hope the UK will lead by example, as per 1940.

Jonathan
Jonathan (@guest_829264)
15 days ago

Russian aggression towards Ukraine predates any thought of joining the EU and began in 2004..essentially as soon as Putin had secured his hold on Russia he moved to do the same in Ukraine…we in the west forget political warfare is still war and that’s what Putin started waging on Ukraine in 2004…when it finally backfired in 2014..he just moved straight to Kinetic warfare via an invasion of Crimea and proxy warfare in the east..when after 8 years that did not bring Ukraine to heel he went for a beheading invasion of the west of the country via Belarus….buggered that up… Read more »

Last edited 15 days ago by Jonathan
Simon
Simon (@guest_829292)
15 days ago

Ukraine may have remained neutral if it had the means to defend itself but now its best hope is to join eu and nato after hostilities. Russia cannot be trusted.putin previously turned the gas supply off in wintertime. Ukraine will have to get up to European level of public standards etc to be allowed in.

Steve R
Steve R (@guest_829263)
15 days ago

The defence I’m reading here from commenters of Farage – as much a Russian puppet as Le Penne or even Trump – is absolutely disgusting.

Farage is a disgrace, and I thank the powers that be that he has zero chance of gaining any real power in the UK.

Barry White
Barry White (@guest_829293)
15 days ago
Reply to  Steve R

What did Boris say in 2016?

Paul T
Paul T (@guest_829300)
15 days ago
Reply to  Steve R

Farage called this in 2010,there is plenty of evidence to prove he was right.

Jonathan
Jonathan (@guest_829312)
15 days ago
Reply to  Paul T

There was no “calling it” …Russia had imperialist eyes on Ukraine from 2004…Putin was determined to add Ukraine to his crown,,,his attacks from 2004 were via political warfare ( poisoning and subversion ) but they were attacks none the less…Ukraine did not come out and say it wanted to join NATO and the EU until 2019…Russia attacked Ukraine 5 years before that…even when the Ukrainian government gave assurances it would not look to join NATO…Farages statement that “we caused it” essentially puts him in the same class as any other political warfare asset of the anti western powers so he… Read more »

Last edited 15 days ago by Jonathan
Steve R
Steve R (@guest_829407)
15 days ago
Reply to  Paul T

No.

He was wrong in 2010 and he’s wrong now.

Countries are free to join NATO if they wish and Russia has f*ck all right to dictate it or not.

If they didn’t want their neighbours to join NATO then maybe Russia should have been a better neighbour towards them. Their actions in Ukraine have proven those countries 100% right to join NATO, and it’s very likely that had the Baltic States not joined when they did, Russia would have already taken them well before now.

Ron
Ron (@guest_829379)
15 days ago

A bit late but never mind. I lived and worked in both Ukraine and Russia for that matter also in Poland, and Czechoslovakia yeep that far back. One of the things that I noticed in Russia is they seem to think that everyone is out to get them. Even when I tried to sit down with them and explain that first of all Russia is to big to invade, even if NATO did invade what then Russia is to big to police it is just plain stupid on their part to think that Europe/ NATO would attack. That NATO was… Read more »

Steve
Steve (@guest_829394)
15 days ago

We had boris partying with Russian kgb officers as nato met over the Salisbury poisoning and then appointing someone to the Lords against advice from the security services.

May telling MI6 not to investigate Russian influence in the election / brexit election.

Farage constantly taking money from Russia and repeating rubbish.

Newspapers that don’t challenge the government’s answer to things like this.

We badly need a proper clear house investigation into just how much influence Russia has into our politics. Well maybe further just foreign influence as I would bet China is probably upto similar along with the US.

Last edited 15 days ago by Steve
Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829587)
14 days ago
Reply to  Steve

👍Exactly!

Micki
Micki (@guest_829577)
14 days ago

It,s true or not that Nato expanded to the east? It,s true or not that Nato surrounded Russia ?

Meirion X
Meirion X (@guest_829586)
14 days ago
Reply to  Micki

Have you Not, looked at the rest of the thread further up?
If so, you will find the answer is the opposite, it’s ruZZia that has expended it’s imperial ambitions!

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829606)
14 days ago
Reply to  Micki

Facts time. Even with Finland and Sweden now joining NATO. Russia is not “surrounded” Russia has over 14,000km of sea border and 36,000kms of land border of which only around 1400kms are adjoining a NATO country. So far from being “surrounded” Russia is a paranoid state fearful of an invasion that will never happen. Is it paranoia or is it that Putin and his odious henchmen simply repeat the mantra “we are being surrounded by NATO” to feed the paranoia? Russia is too big to invade and also is nuclear armed, like the USA, UK, France therefore an invasion is… Read more »

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829613)
14 days ago
Reply to  Micki

If the orcs were that concerned about NATO invading they would not have stripped the Finnish border of most of their forces to send to Ukraine would they?

Russ
Russ (@guest_829677)
13 days ago
Reply to  Jacko

Just a thought. But if Farage was so bothered about being “misinterpreted”, Why did he do the interview and say what he said on RT? Not exactly a channel known for its balance or for NOT being a mouthpiece of the Russian state.

Jacko
Jacko (@guest_829691)
13 days ago
Reply to  Russ

No idea mate but as I’ve said I don’t get a vote in England if I want to vote for them here in NI I have to vote TUV and that is a wasted one 👍

Wasp snorter
Wasp snorter (@guest_829896)
13 days ago
Reply to  Micki

No one cares about Russia in reality, no one wants to invade it or surround it. In fact nobody wants to even have a border with it, given all the nuclear weopons and horrible pollution and hyper corruption. Russia does not appeal to anyone in the modern world, who the hell would even want to live there. NATO is to protect us from their stupid world view and paranoia. The reason neighbouring countries ‘or moving East’ as you put it as though it is Operation Barborossa, is because it’s the countries nearby who get invaded by Russia. The real problem… Read more »

Mr Bell
Mr Bell (@guest_829591)
14 days ago

Farage comments demonstrate an over simplified view of the world and a misinterpretation of the facts. Russia and Mad Vlad the Impalers are a military dictatorship state run by a fascist right wing emperor hell bent on returning “Russian territories and people’s to mother Russia” Ukraine as a democratic and sovereign nation has the right to decide it’s own course without having to bend the knee to Russia’s wishes. Idiotic comments from Farage are precisely why he cannot be trusted and we shouldn’t be wasting our votes on an individual and party (Reform) with such a slanted away from reality… Read more »

Zac
Zac (@guest_829858)
13 days ago

Despite what he claims Farage doesn’t want to be elected. He’s deliberately making himself unelectable. Every time he came close to being elected in the past he disappeared off stage for a while. He knows that British people strongly support Ukraine. His comments suggest that Eastern Europe is passively accepting EU/NATO expansion as though they’re not actively seeking alignment with us precisely because they know what Russia is like. Russia left Kalinograd in place precisely as a pretext for future expansion retaking ex-USSR territories. Thats why it left Russians in Transnistria and is currently trying to cause unrest in Moldova.… Read more »

Tomartyr
Tomartyr (@guest_829920)
13 days ago

Why is it so common for the right to be duped into treason?
It makes some sense for the internationalist left but it’s very strange that the nationalist right are almost universally Putin sympathisers.

Hereward
Hereward (@guest_830006)
13 days ago

This reasons behind this conflict is more than a simple black hat/white hat.yet there is reluctance to talk about it, and to abuse those who wish to explore it
There are far greater dangers to our society than Russian Naval Infantry pouring ashore on Brighton beach.

Paul.P
Paul.P (@guest_830309)
11 days ago

As often seen on UKDJ – impressed and informed posts. It is true that Russia is a geographically and culturally landlocked nation and historically familiar with suffering. Farage is pointing out that they have a bunker mentality and a persecution complex psychology. Is this a case of ‘it takes one to know one’?