HMS Anson is the fifth of seven Astute class nuclear powered submarines being built for the Royal Navy.
The submarine is named after 18th Century Admiral George Anson who delivered an impressive victory over the French at Cape Finisterre in 1747 and went on to reform the Admiralty.
HMS Anson rolling out from BAE in Barrow today pic.twitter.com/VGYE8bq1xx
— Jayne Moorby (@JayneMoobs) April 19, 2021
Busy launching a boat today #hmsanson @BAES_Maritime @RoyalNavy
— Paul O’Reilly (@pauloreillyrn) April 19, 2021
HMS Anson was officially named in a ceremony at the BAE yard in Barrow-In-Furness in December last year.
Anson’s first Commanding Officer, Commander David ‘Bing’ Crosby, said recently that it was now time for the ship’s company “to bring HMS Anson to life”.
“It will require all of us to work together to achieve this goal, but we are ready for the challenge – and we are determined to succeed.”
Anson will enter the water shortly – there’s a basin next to the Devonshire Hall not only large enough to accommodate her, but also to allow a practice dive which almost allows the boat to completely submerge.
Her punch, say the Royal Navy, will be delivered by Tomahawk cruise missiles and the newly-upgraded Spearfish torpedoes being introduced to the Fleet from 2021.
Anson is due to remain in Barrow for completion until 2022 before leaving for sea trials and joining her older sisters at HMNB Clyde, while BAE finish the final two Astute-class boats: Agamemnon and Agincourt, completing the programme in 2025 after a quarter century of work on the entire programme, say the Royal Navy.
Let’s hope the drumbeat of the successor class is a little faster.
25 years is crazy, OK we all know that drumbeat pause caused it, but even so it is inevitable if you build things that slowly that technology overtakes them; hence the, effectively, split class.
Ain’t that the truth….. At least after cracking on with Dreadnaught, the design and build teams will be able to turn to the Successor class SSN without the massive issues caused by the delay in building the Astute class.
wait will the Trafalgar be fully replaced by then by the astute? if so then who will replace the astute? otherwise we would have a 4 boat gap.
We are currently at 6 SSNs, with Trenchant about to be decommissioned, both Talent and Triumph will be kept in service a few (2ish) years longer to cover for the last two Astute class being commisioned-at least that’s the plan I believe.
Astute has been in comission since 2010, so theoretically is good until 2040, by which time she will need replacing and so on.
I imagine the plan would be to have the first SSN(R) in the water and ready to go by 2038/9. Who knows!!!
Are those grilles inside the red line?
Yes. They are open to the forward ballast tanks and allow them to flood when the vents at the top of the tanks are opened for the boat to dive.
At last!
The successor Class will likely end up just as long and drawn out, late and over budget
Think we really need to look at building diesel-electric submarines as we just take too long building these fancy but too few Astute Class
The new Japanese 3000t Taigei Class is only taking only 2 years to build!
Or German Type 212As
Japanese defence sees a very, very rapid process of building, operating & retiring. I suspect they are already working on the next class of boats, beyond the Taigei (which itself is the product of the Ōryū). There are two things here, 1) the speed the JMSDF like to do things. 2) Nuclear powerplants do take more time by definition. Japan has a lot of littoral waters to defend, not really blue water. The RN, blue water, totally different anticipated use, offensive defensive etc. It would be wiser to compare our build speed with peers like Virginia or Yasen, though the… Read more »
Interesting on the fast production/operation cycle, I wonder if that’s to do with the L-ion batteries they use (I think they do?); maybe they get knackered quicker from all the cycling?
Hi Joe, not entirely sure what @GlynH is referring to with rapid process of retiring units, especially SMs, they currently have 3 classes now in service, although the Taigei is brand new and a test bed for new technologies (sonar and propulsion).
They have just invested heavily in L-ion battery technology, and have substituted AIP systems in the last two Soryu class for more L-ion battery capacity.
Hi John. We have zero requirement for diesel boats. We stopped operating them over 30 years ago. It would just take away money and personnel that could be much better spent on equipment we actually need. So 7 Astute boats it is. And they are incredible feats of engineering and capability.
I think that point could be debated Robert. Diesel electric subs do have their strategic uses and if bought could free up the SSN subs for other roles. Albeit I do not think they should be purchased at the expense of another piece of more important kit, which I think is one of the points your alluding to. I’m by no means an expert, but I do understand diesel electric subs are used in litterol zones and can be exceedingly quiet. With China having such a large navy and not being a particularly benevolent global partner, I think the UK… Read more »
Money is limited and reality is the surface fleet is more useful during peace times (policing roles /, showing the flag) which makes them better value for money. If you build more subs, then something else has to be cut, which for the navy would mean either less man power or surface ships.
We’ve already started work on unmanned XLUUV which is diesel electric.
Yes that’s the rub isn’t it. Trying to balance a ‘peace time fleet’ as you mention it, with having serious war fighting capability if required.
To be fair, I think we have done pretty well at this in the past, the issue now is the speed at which China are building their navy and the way the country is behaving. Our old model doesn’t work with China as a strategic rival so something has to change. Current strategy still seems to pretend China aren’t a rival and pretend their massive military build up poses minimal threat to our country.
Aren’t we building some autonomous subs termed XLUUVs I believe these are diesel-electric.
My assumption is these will ultimately replace existing platforms and help justify cuts in sailors, like appears to be happening with soldiers. Sub surface unmanned tech is still in its early days though.
Thanks exact, wasn’t aware of these, will look into further.
Also, counter to my latest post, there does seem to be some understanding that China now poses us a threat, hence a planned increase in our nuclear stocks, but I get the impression our gov don’t have the best idea how to deal with them. Imho increasing naval assets would be a good place to start. Here’s a link to the guardian talking about the above (no endorsement of the paper, just came up first in Google search)
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/16/china-is-major-threat-but-uk-will-keep-up-trade-links-says-defence-review
I dont think the increase in nukes is real. The government is increasing the max we can hold but declined to confirm the actual number.
Realistically considering the relative buying powers of China vs UK, what exactly can we do to counter them.
stop making them rich.
So you as a consumer is happy to pay significantly more for everything? I read its cheaper to send fish to China to be packaged before sending to the EU to sell, than it is to do in the UK. We live in a consumer world where race to the button in prices wins. The only way we stop making China rich is they hit the same wage/health&safety requirements of the West, at which point another country will under cut them.
If it were made a better quality and will last longer then yes, I’d be happy to pay more.
Much of what is made in China is cheaply made and cheap to throw away and replace. If we made things of better quality design and build that are made to last, then yes, I’m happy to pay more for it.
I think you have rose tinted glasses there. Build quality was not really a standard that Britain was famous for, remember the shoddy standard of build quality of British cars vs their German or Asia counter parts in the 70s. However shorter life span and cheaper materials come back to consumer demand for cheapness. Better built stuff generally still exists but is a massive niche market. Also if something is only made in the west, the base price for the same product would be significantly higher even before you take into account improving material or quality. The two are not… Read more »
For our economy it’s better to tackle the way US companies keep buying up all our tech firms. High tech industries in the service sector is the future for western nations and no nation can now take on silicone Valley as its been left to be super uncompetitive both in practices and taxes.
We are or were talking about Chinese products. I am happy to buy from any country if their products are of better quality to anything made in the UK, just not Chinese stuff, too much experience of their cheap rubbish over the years.
Hello mate, you don’t know anything about me, what I do, how I make money, what I do for a living, but a simple answer is Yes. I’m happy to pay for quality and happy to avoid buying anything Chinese as far as I can. I also apply this to my three Business’s as far as possible. Buy cheap, buy twice.
I was more talking the general population than you personally. I fully agree with the sentiment of raining in Chinese economic power, but I don’t see how that is possible. Decades of consumer culture and race to the button, means that its now impossible to unwind, as it would mean mass inflation (prices would sky rocket). The example is the US made iphone that was launched a few years ago. It was i think somewhere between 50-100 dollars more expensive and no one brought it, even though the US is always talking about buy American, but when it comes to… Read more »
Exactly how I see it too, That’s why I’m trying to do my part, just like re-cyling my rubbish, It’s a tiny drop in the ocean especially when you think about the 7 Billion others but, it’s a start.
There are a number of other places that do compete with China. Vietnam and Taiwan spring to mind. Have you heard of the Raspberry Pi computer? It was designed in the UK but made in China, in 2012 there was cist exercise done which found Sony UK could make the product cheaper, production was relocated back to the UK.
Which uses Arm architecture which is owned by softbank of China and most of its chips are from chinese chip makers.
The UK still makes plenty of things, its one of the top exporting countries, they just tend to be more complex stuff and not generally consumer items, plus of course the service sector.
Its the mass market stuff that china excels it, because it has almost zero wage costs and same in regards to cares around health and safety of its staff.
Softbsnk of Japan, the point is the cost analysis was done and it was cheaper to make the Pi in the UK. If you want avoid buying Chinese you can most people just aren’t interested.
Call that one out for two reasons.
1. Operations manager has closed a plant in China and relocated to Latvia citing high cost of Chinese labour.
2. Latvian fish cannery were in China last year on trade mission: price, quality, safety.
(They supply Princess fish).
So, China is changing but is not improving manufacturing standards nor keeping labour overheads down.
Robert, in reality we do have a need for AIP boats. 1. The Med, yes we can use a SSN but a big sub in the Med is a target, even during WW2 the RN had large losses of their big subs whilst the smaller subs ran riot. 2. North Sea and Baltic, not really the place to operate a big 7000 ton sub, in many areas to shallow. 3. The West coast of Scotland, with all the Islands and our Nuc base they would be useful in area patrol, we do not need to use a SSN in this… Read more »
Hi Ron, an interesting post, lots of good points, however, I think you may have points 7+8 a little mixed up. SSKs whether AIP or not, do not make good CSG escorts, as they don’t have the speed endurance required to keep pace or indeed get ahead of the CSG. Yes you are correct that they are quiter than a SSN especially at low speeds, and yes they can do 20kts dived, but, that’s only for a relatively short period, as it would drain the battery very quickly. AIP systems allow them to stay submerged for longer periods, but cannot… Read more »
Hello Mate, once again I must say how much I enjoy reading your posts and informative replies here, you obviously know your stuff and I applaud you for your honest and non aggressive approach. I also enjoy your comments on other sites. Some other posters on here would do well to take heed and contribute in a much nicer fashion too. Just sayin like !!!!
LOL Capt, you’re not too shabby yourself, always enjoy the humour. Yes, have to agree with you, there are some rather unpleasant types about on said sites, all a tad un- necessary if you ask me, must be something in the water!!
Interesting conversation re ssk speed, however, would the answer not be to forward stage rather than the sub trying to keep up?
Morning, in regard to forward staging, both yes and no. Yes get the SSK out to where you want it, and if it were a static patrol area then it would probably work to a certain degree. Any such patrol area would probably be very large ,so, you still run into the same problem of repositioning your SSK where time is a factor. Unfortunately with the CSG going from A-Z via all points in-between, any sudden course/destination change along said route for whatever reason, can place any pre positioned unit in the wrong area, again having to shift itself in… Read more »
Thank you for a thoughtful answer, appreciated.
The Astute class are indeed great boats. But the reason for not continuing to operate SSKs was financial, not operational. Just as the number of SSNs was cut from 12, to 10, to 8, to 7….
Diesel boats don’t really fit our needs though. We need subs that can dive once they leave port then potentially travel to any point on the globe without coming to the surface again. Diesels just don’t offer that.
The deterrent effect of the possibility of one of our untraceable nuclear powered subs possibly being in an area can’t be underestimated and in some ways could be considered a force multiplier.
When a Submarine leaves Port it will Dive as soon as there is enough Water Depth for it to do so,this applies to either an SSBN/SSN or SSK,and SSK’s don’t necessarily have to Surface on route,they have Snorkels for Replenishment of Air and Batteries etc.
Well yes but I seem to recall an incident with HMS Asstoot, a while back…. something to do with a submerged Continental Shelf wasn’t it ?
Indeed – HMS Astute hasn’t been blessed with much luck during her career.
Has this programme taught the MoD anything? It would be a first if so.
Would be nice if all the German subs weren’t stuck at their docks so a few British subs could help out in the Pacific.
They aren’t but never mind…
It would be nice if the U.S.N. actually had invested in REAL sub-hunting frigates instead of those Littoral Combat Ship toys that are tied up at the docks all the time.
A few subs? You mean the whole available fleet!
Would be nice if you posted some interesting stuff rather than constant put downs about “the Brits” lack of assets.
How big is the US defence budget again compared to other nations?
Hang on, I think know this Daniele…. Is it twice as much or as much as every other Nation put together ? ( Vacant look Emoji face thing ! ) lol.
That’s what I thought but wasn’t sure.
A bit like an iceberg!! There is sooo much of the boat which is below the water line, whilst surfaced. The are good looking boats, though. About time they got on with the others.
The battleship of the RN. Brilliant assets.
Totally. Somewhat underated I feel.
Absolutely right. Really are the modern day battleship. The Falklands war was a perfect example.. One nuclear RN sub altered completely the sea campaign. Scares the living daylights out of any opposition that does not have one.
ARA San Luis nearly sunk a british navy ship in the falklands war.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARA_San_Luis_(S-32)
Interesting read, Thx
Good news just need about 7 more 🐳
Superb bit of kit, congrats to all involved.
Why would we not just keep delivering one of these every 2 years or so for the next ten, upgrading them them as they come – always the most up to date kit onboard? They are without doubt the most effective spend of military budget for the UK in it’s unique political position globally. A fleet of 12 or so would be a far better and useful number than 7. Oh but the costs! (at 1 billion ea….) In May last year NHS Test and Trace (NHST&T) was set up with a budget of £22 billion. Since then it has… Read more »
Cost per Boat is one thing but Cost to Crew and Run is something else, as is Maintenance and Upgrade all over a probable 30 Years, then they have to be Decommissioned. 14 Boats would have a huge cost when you add it all up.
Not as much as you might think:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/456954/20150820-2015-06437_Fish__redacted.pdf
If I’m reading that correctly it says nearly £10 Million per annum per Astute class Boat. So that’s £70 Million per Annum (7 Boats) x 30 Years at todays prices, plus everything else including Decommissioning. That all adds up to a Staggering amount.
Oh and plus the @ £10 Billion cost to build the 7 Boats.
The Test and Trace budget includes the vaccine. Every test center that has been set up across the country, the deployment of rapid local testing. The detecting of new strains of the virus. It is not just for the NHS app and a call centre. If we don’t get on top of COVID-19, then it’s a bigger hit to the economy, which will mean even less money for defence.
Not my opinion – just that of the parliamentary committee – either believe them or not:
Yet despite the unimaginable resources thrown at this project Test and Trace cannot point to a measurable difference to the progress of the pandemic, and the promise on which this huge expense was justified – avoiding another lockdown – has been broken, twice.
Quoted from the report.
Also I cannot find that T&T includes procuring the issuing the vaccine. Pease advise your source on that one?
I’m not doubting the committee. But spending huge amounts on protecting the public against a global pandemic cannot be used as a leveraging stick to justify spending equally huge extra sums on defence.
The committee statements indicate strongly that indeed no significant positive effects were gained for the money spent, so there was little or no ”protecting of the public” going on at all. This was money flushed away on a farcical psuedo scientific jaunt into la la land, for the benefit of private consultants mostly. My point is that whilst we whittle away our defence of the realm capability, on a hair shirt approach to every spending decision, we merrily pee it up the wall when the nonsense factory (House of commons) feels like it. The report concludes that MPs should not… Read more »
The 37Bn hasn’t all been spent. 37bn is the budget over two years from last April 2020 up to April 2022. Only 5.7bn of that has been spent up to November 2020. 93M tests have been carried out. 50,000 staff have been recruited for the whole project to date. It’s worth remembering. No amount of Astute class boats can save us from a global pandemic. And 190Bn on defence equipment is hardly defence on the cheap.
Well I had my first jab yesterday and I thought it was organised superbly. Well done to all involved.
Second Jab for me tomorrow … in and out really smoothly first time.
Yeah, but what about the organisation? 🙂
Lol…. I just knew there would be someone with a sense of humour along at some point !!!!!!
I’ve been in shit state since mind with the side effects.
Happy day’s mate. Should be getting mine in the next few weeks fingers crossed.
The land attack capability of these is great capability. US have gone a step further converting 4 Ohio class for land attack capable of launching 154 TLAMs. I know the answer to this but I guess there’s no chance of us getting one more Dreadnought for land attack only. I can see the capability being expanded to launch drones in future and anti air missiles.
Being able to launch a TLAM covertly is a great asset, realistically though if you’re looking at launching hundreds then you’d be better sticking them on an RFA/large merch and having an escort. Certainly a lot cheaper.
The political clout of the potential enemy not knowing if they have a sub with 100+ land attack missiles shouldn’t be underestimate. It doesn’t even have to be there, they just have to think it is, subtle leak to the press would do that. Preventing a war is cheaper than fighting one. I think the latter idea of using an RFA is useful once you’re in shooting match.
This is where we enter the realms of ‘fantasy fleet Expat, at least for me and no offence intended. I agree, its a great ability but its not one that I’d expect the UK to maintain. As it stands we have very limited submarine platforms and to have one (what happens when its tied up alongside with defects) dedicated to this just isn’t feasible when we’re talking about UK numbers. We have the capability to throw up to 30 or so into a country’s infrastructure its not a bad option that can be relatively quickly achieved with a new weapons… Read more »
Not disagreeing. Its fantasy fleet stuff. We’d need to invest in more than one as you pointed out, that’s why the US converted 4 Ohios class. I’ll wait to see how the UK will field hypersonic land attack missiles. US will use the silos on the converted Ohios and new vertical luanch tubes installed on the latest Virginia class boats to field boast glide hypersonic missiles. We have no such option. Mk41 vls to be fitted to some of the surface fleet is too short for a boast glide weapon. Perhaps there’s no interest or intent to venture into hypersonic… Read more »
25 years to finally be born. Great boat, but bloody hell, that timeline is pathetic beyond words.
I suppose we should look at it from another POV though….. what if these had all been built within a few years, Would we still have had the T class Boats as well ? At least they are being built to replace on a Like for like basis (almost) with additional upgrades to each Boat.
25 years is just too much. The tech might be half a generation behind or more because of it. We could order more boats when we complete research/design to keep the yards churning and holding onto skills.
Get them all out to see within 10-15 years.
I agree about time scales mate but I can also see that despite this, they are pretty impressive when compared (on paper) to others. Some might say they are better even. Lets just hope we never have to find out.
I think it’s also just about our place in the world. We can’t flex our muscles, when we have to; (hopefully never have a PM/govt that feels it needs to flex). We should have the boats and all of our new kit in a timely order so we can project our force most of the time when the times arise. Right now, if it kicks off at the Ukrainian border, in Taiwan or South Korea, we’re kind of in the position of needing at least a decade for all our upgrades and new kit to tested, built, integreted and then… Read more »
Yup, I think you are spot on there to be honest.
So this costs a billion? Quick sums in head time and? Two fat aircraft carriers = twelve hidden submarines. I know where I would put public money.
Ah but POW was almost a Sub and it does have a hanger for Aircraft !!!!
Wonder if Fat Lizzy will stay watertight all the way to Nippon? Be funny if they had to ground it on an artificial Chinese island.
@ Karl, made me laugh boet. They love aircraft carriers on here!
Have you never watched top gun. What’s not to love about aircraft carriers. 😀
I did like the Tomcats. The story was kak.
Is that a bit of bitterness Ivan because your nation does not have one?
Who is Ivan? Ffs, you guys all calling each other out, some Superb (SWIDT) posts by Deep32, rein it in please.
Im responding cheaply to Ivans van der dk cheap jibes on the UK forces ,so no.
Or maybe have a little balance, aircraft carriers and maybe a couple more subs.
The Astute class lack warrior spirit names
HMS Vengeance 🥰
When the wokes get on the ship naming case it will be back to Dandy, Rainbow and a few other less aggressive names. I quite like HMS Pink Cloud and HMS Larry Grayson myself.
Well a few years ago myself, the Captain and Mr Bell annoyed others by having a SOH and having a laugh about my VERY stupid idea of firing Pink Dye at Spanish vessels at Gibraltar.
So HMS Pink Cloud might have some legs in it!
It was the most gender-neutral name l could conjure up. Also, l think grey is an aggressive colour and ships should be painted in none aggressive and vegan-friendly schemes.
Oh my, I remember that convo!
Yes, it was daft, but fun. That whole thread was full of spats.